AMEN! (and I'm not necessarily religious lol)

Ignorant global comment - do you have any idea what most federal worker do??

As I have said before -- at all levels in my 25+ years working in military, federal and private sector - some small percent of workers truly do not earn their keep. The number I would say that fits this bill is in the lower single digit percentage band... not 50% as so many freely blurt out without any facts.... I helped a few of this folks move on to other opportunities...................

Large numbers of federal workers work for DoD and other security related organizations.. In fact - the Federal civilian workforce was at an all time low in number going back to the 50's and 60's in 1999-2000. Lots of DoD and Security related hiring in civilain workforce post 9/11. Federal Civilain workforce still fairly low compared to many years in the last 50 years with a much larger US population and more complex world to deal with today.. Especially in the IT and cybersecurity areas...............

Still room to "right size"

To the article -- headline incomplete - I'm one of those with multiple advance degrees including a profession degree as a DVM - Doctor of Veterinarian Medicine. Most of my similar age colleages on the outside that work full time earn more than my civilian salary even if you included benefits - several much more. Most made more on a year by year comparison over my working life than what I making in the military as well.

Still no regrets - glad to serve -- beleive I have earned by salary and benefits in my 25+ years of working -- but as the article states in small print many with advanced degrees make less than their private sector counterparts.

Dr. T

Wage increases for Federal workers are controlled by the cost of living index - inflation. Private workers are not protected by that level of enforced 'fairness'.

What these results show is that the wages of lower tier private sector workers have not kept pace with inflation. The results also show that wages for 'skilled' private sector workers have increased with inflation. What is not reported is that top level private sector compensation has skyrocketed compared to equivalent government compensation and inflation.

The two political ways to look at the data is that either Federal workers (by keeping up with inflation) have been unfairly compensated - or - private sector workers (by not keeping up with inflation) have been screwed.

Notice that inflation is at the heart of both political arguments - and - that both political arguments will ignore that inflation favors the compensation of those not mentioned in the article at all.

The real problem is simply being ignored ...

Hey stoney get over yourself, the GOV has sold US out. Welcome to main street and NO JOBS! The time will come for U!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I wonder if this included all the vacation pay, paid holidays, sick days and other non cash items? Does it also figure in age at which federal workers retire? Does it consider that the paid in retirement (social security) is insolvent and will be cut, while the non contributory federal workers retirement is not? Personally have never seen any government worker work as hard or have as much stress as private workers.

State, city and county workers are even more overpaid in California. Recently saw an under sheriff , retire after 25 years with a $209,000 a year retirement. Lifeguards retire after 25 years with about $100,000. fire chiefs more than $250,000 after 25 years on job. How many doctors can retire at the age of 52 and have $100,000 in retirement income?.....None

To get this kind of cash flow from investments you need many millions of dollars in investments.

the real 1% is the government workers. Used to be CEO's on the golf course, now it is the retired government workers.

I don't begrudge people who (for the same type of work) earn more than I do, get better benefits than I do, and obain all this for working less than I do....but I do mind...when I'm paying for it!

Federal workers hired after 1986 DO contribute to Social Security, as well as contributing a percentage of their pay to their own federal retirement accounts. Also, their pay raises are not tied to the cost of living, they are increased by acts of Congress each year (or not increased at all, as they put a freeze on federal pay raises for the past 2 years). If you read the article closely, you will see that the title is misleading - federal employees with college degrees make MUCH LESS than their counterparts in the private sector. I should know - I have been a fed employee since 1995 and could make a whole lot more as a private consultant. However, I am dedicated to my work and my reward is in serving this great country of ours.

The study fails to address the efficiency of the Federal Worker. (A bit of a misnomer), Federal, Worker, the two words don't come off the tongue easily.

Back to efficiency! So, factor that into the equation and you will find a severe disparity. The Public Sector Employment was designed to fill low skill jobs with less skilled employees. The best way to attract these low wage, low skilled workers was to offer an attractive benefit package. Today, it is completely out of control. There is no accountability for the wage disparity from Private to Public.

stoney ?

Still no regrets - glad to serve -- beleive I have earned by salary and benefits in my 25+ years of working -- but as the article states in small print many with advanced degrees make less than their private sector counterparts.

I believe, that once again, you also omit pertinent info. As for instance, lets say a federal accountant $79,000 .. private ..$81 PAY ONLY.. now lets factor in bennies. Have you any idea who pays for the private accts. benefits?

We can pick certain fields all day long and find differences. Yours for instance. I personally know 4 vets. None of them make what you make. And then AGAIN we're going to factor in benefits. NONE of them get up to 16 plus paid holidays. NONE of them get paid this and that. And so on and so forth. In fact, NONE of them have ANY BENEFITS. As most all are self employed. Couple of them can't even afford basic medical.

But then again, I live in rural usa. So we all see things from a different perspective.

One of the MAJOR problems now, is the 'move' towards retirement at ONLY 25 years service for public workers. That is an extremely expensive perk to ask/make the average john/jane doe pony up for.

If you fire half the Federal workers and put the other half to work you'll still have to many.

Well they are working to get rid of 80K Federal workers. However the Army is only reducing by 14% not 50% sounds like you don't want us to have any Army or Navy or Air Force.

out. Welcome to main street and NO JOBS! The time will come for U!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

There are millions of jobs out there. Sorry if you picked a career that you cant hired in. I choose one that I can get hired in hours with no issues.

take my profession degree field and "correct" for locaility and "time in career"

I been working as a Veterinarian/Master degree in Public and Epidemiologist for about 25+ years now (some in private sector, most in military and some as GS FED). So absolutely - I earned less early in my life than I do now and earnings changed a great deal based on locality..

I also said many of my full time working colleages make more than I do even counting benefits - not all. Clearly, rural veterinary practice in farm practice or small animal practice in certain localities would make less than me as a senior employee (25+ year) in WA DC (I'm not that far from being 62 - single digits years and will be one of retired baby boomers). My classmates (graduated in 1985) and other colleages in same year group in southern california / WA DC or the northeast US or those working for some states or pharmaceutical companies. a few have died..

I know a few fairly young in their career vets making the same and a few making more than me today with many years ahead of them -- good on them..

My federal service time will be over 30 years when I'm done - most in the military with deployments and the like overseas and lots of moving.

so again - I proud to serve, no regrets and think I have earn my keep

I still beleive most folks are off the mark demonizing the vast majority of federal GS workers

stoney-3054460...........Ignorant global comment - do you have any idea what most federal worker do??

Agree, but what about groups like the Dept of Energy? What about the thousands and thousands of workers put on the payroll with the new oversight agencies? You are not defending wasteful government spending and hiring...are you?

@bluewave -- Presidential requests for Federal pay increases have been tied to the cost of living index since Reagan. The CPI has always been the excuse for limiting requested pay increases. Yes, the pay increases are requested by the President and approved by Congress - that is how all government spending works.

Federal employees contributed 7.5% of their pay to the CSRS retirement system (replaced by FERS) since 1956, I believe. Until the introduction of the FERS system - Federal workers contributed a third more to their retirement benefits than private sector workers did to SSI. The FERS system is a mix of SSI benefits and a government pension. The pension benefit is offset by Federal retirees being covered by Medicaid - not Medicare - unless something has changed over the last ten years.

"Federal workers with a high school education or less earn about $4 more an hour than private sector employees in similar jobs."

Nerm said it well:

"The two political ways to look at the data is that either Federal workers (by keeping up with inflation) have been unfairly compensated - or - private sector workers (by not keeping up with inflation) have been screwed."

The people who are suffering most from the economic downturn are the people who have the lowest paying jobs. The government should not be paying less to its lowest paid employees, the private sector should be paying more.

As a matter of fact, the private sector should never have been allowed to deprive workers of pensions and benefits. We would not be in the mess we are in now if the private sector had been held accountable. It's all about greed, of course. The few are mightily compensated at the expense of the many who are, to quote Nerm, "screwed."

And Kenn the Dem -- we pay for it no matter what. Federal employees get paid through government revenue; private employees get paid through our purchases. The difference here is that the corporatists who run the private sector skim off a whole bunch of your money for themselves before the employees get theirs.

You've probably noticed prices of things going up... and up. We pay for it, all right.

Theoretically, money I pay in taxes in one way or another benefits me and my community. Some of the money I put in the hands of the private sector will make its way into the hands of employees and other workers, but ultimately it benefits those who already have more than they can use.

(Practically, with government outsourcing, that may not be entirely true. But that is another post.)

To all you Federal Government employee haters, here's a bit of reality for you. The front line employees out there, whether DoD, IRS, FAA, DoA, Commerce, whoever; are some the hardest working, least compensated in the country. Where the problem comes in is the grossly inflated and absolutely unproductive managerial class in the Government.

True story; in my facility we had 8 staff specialists supporting the operation and 5 managers overseeing them. And this was in 2006. Today, we've added 2 more managers and no more staff specialists. And the managers are universally Republican POS's who rail against wasteful government spending.

Ironic, huh?

Sorry stoney....

These well paid employees are the same ones that fell asleep at the wheel while Madoff was committing fraud, the Deep Horizon had an environmental plan that protected seals, and the people who were supposed to be monitoring fracking in PA that lead to faucets spewing out flames.

I have worked as an engineer in a variety of fields. Overall, I have not been impressed with the government engineers who repeatedly demonstrate a lack of an ability to design a good system.

This is has been known for some time...what the government supporters always refused to acknowledge was when you factored in benefits, the disparity sky rocketed and that was the main point of people who believe that fed/government workers are better compensated for less risk.

At least we now have a government funded study to back it up.

The problem isnt worker pay, its the fact that they are not needed to begin with. I have no problem paying workers. Who wants a yuts doing work. My issue with like the SEC or Department of education and a whole host of others is that they dont' need to exist to begin with.

James, I wouldn't call a 16% disparity "skyrocketing".

And considering that many private sector worker don't even have health coverage, I wouldn't say that federal workers are overpaid. A lot of private corporations are just too damn stingy to give their workers basic benefits, despite recording record profits.

And speaking of profits, since when did ANY federal worker make $882 MILLION a year? That's the average earnings of the top 25 hedge fund managers in America.

The really silly argument that government workers give to justify higher wages is "We have more years of experience", when the reality is that they only have more years of service because they can't be fired - even if they are incompetent, which many of them are.

Turnover in the private sector averages about 5 years (produce or be laid off), but turnover in the public sector averages about 20 years (you can't be fired, and who'd give up that gravy train).

To Bluewave (post 1.7)

You say;

"Federal workers hired after 1986 DO contribute to Social Security, as well as contributing a percentage of their pay to their own federal retirement accounts."

Actually, that's those hired after 1983 contribute to Social Security, not after 1986.

In addition, those Federal Workers who were hired in 1983 and prior are under the CSRS retirement system. This defined benefit (which they pay into) is in lieu of Social Security. They do not receive BOTH unless they work outside Federal Service as well, and pay into Social Security for at least another 10 years (40 quarters). And then because of the CSRS pension, their Social Security entitlement is cut by at least one third.

The big disparity comes in when you look at benefits. The benefits a government employee gets are completely out of line with private industry. Government employees get two to four time the amount of paid time off that those in the private sector get. All government employees get 13 days of sick leave a year and can accumulate an unlimited amount. In private industry, most do not get any separate sick leave and must use their regular leave if they get ill and those that do get sick leave can not carry it over from one year to the next. When government types are getting ready to retire they frequently get some doctor to say they need a "rest" so that they can burn off the 9 months of sick leave they have on the books before they put in their retirement paperwork. In some cases they even used to be able to get some credit for any unused sick leave to count it towards their total time working to boost their retirement pay. As for vacation time, the entry level government employees start off with 13 day. After three years of service this goes to 20 days, and after 15 years this goes to 26 days. In private industry, entry level is lucky to get 10 days total paid time off and those in the three to 15 year range might be getting 15 days . It is virtually unheard of for any private sector employee to get more than 20 days, and even that is rare with most only getting 15 days.

On the health insurance side of things, the government employees pay a much smaller percentage of the premiums than their private sector counterparts, often paying far less in premiums for plans with better benefits and lower copays than their private sector counterparts.

On the retirement side, the government employees really make out. Even those who are in FERS and not part of the old CSRS system are making out well. The government automatically puts in 1% of their salary even if they contribute nothing. This is unheard of in the private sector. Then the government match on employee contributions to the retirement plan are much more generous than what you will get from a private employer (assuming your private company has one) both in the percentage match offered as well as the maximum amount that they will provide the match on.

Add all of this to the fairly comparable pay that most government employees get and their total compensation is well above private industry. About the only area where salary lags in government is those at the very senior levels with advanced degrees. However, even for these employees their is one huge benefit - they are not going to get fired when they screw up or laid off when the company hits tough times. Most of them also do not work the 10 and 11 hour days that are typical at the senior levels in private industry.

When you add productivity into the mix, the disparity between government and private sector pay gets even worse. Most government employees would not last two weeks in private industry because they are not used to meeting the high productivity demands that private employers place on their employees.

So let me get this straight. People are here railing against public workers because they've been lucky enough to have good benefits and medical? I guess those folks forgot that there was a time when private sector workers had it good.

Then, the Republicans started attacking thsoe private sector unions, and viola! Gone are the good wages and good jobs. So, having donethat to the private sector, the GOP and Repubs are going after the public sector unions. And wonders of wonders, the GOP faithful who've lost their union rights now want to take away thsoe rights from their public counterparts.

Well, here's an idea - why don't they ask to have their benefits and medical UPGRADED to match those of their public kin?

Wow, a lot of people on these columns are really shelling out the cash to keep this country running. Considering 47% of wage earners don't pay any income tax, and the loop holes for those making high 6 figures plus leave many of them paying very little also, the middle class must make up a disproportionate number of newsvine posters.

It's time for many of these jobs to be outsourced to the private sector. Even when government contracts are issued to the private sector with the requirement of paying union wages, it is completed at a lower cost than employing a federal work force.

An incredible amount of money would be saved at all levels of government(federal, state, county and municpal) if more work was outsourced to the private sector.

JS in SD, great post. Also, don't forget the "favors" they often do for the workers close to retirement. The abuses during the last few years are outrageous. Many times, the workers getting close to retirement are given brief positions with significant increases in pay or loads of extra OT so their final pension calculations get way inflated. I personally don't have problems with people getting nice job perks/benefits, but I have a real problem with it when it's being done with taxpayer money !!

Dave20121, Although you are correct. Unfortunately, as the belt-way feeders atest, many of these contracts span multiple tenures and get lost in the shuffle. The new guy just comes in and signs the contracts without looking and some company gets a continuous revenue stream without doing anything useful.

I talked with one tech company owner who signed a contract to build software for managing medical information for the armed services. The guy who started the contract got voted out of office and, 3 congressmen later, he was still getting paid without any defined deliverable or delivery date. Of course, I'm not that familiar with government workings. This could go on within government departments only with twice the workers and cost.

FC

"To all you Federal Government employee haters, here's a bit of reality for you. The front line employees out there, whether DoD, IRS, FAA, DoA, Commerce, whoever; are some the hardest working, least compensated in the country. Where the problem comes in is the grossly inflated and absolutely unproductive managerial class in the Government.

True story; in my facility we had 8 staff specialists supporting the operation and 5 managers overseeing them. And this was in 2006. Today, we've added 2 more managers and no more staff specialists. And the managers are universally Republican POS's who rail against wasteful government spending.

Ironic, huh?"

Yes yes yes....many times yes. The fed is bloated up at the top. Same problem at my agency.

Why do they hit us with a big headline stating that government workers make more, and then disclose that that's only true for the lower level jobs, while for those with advanced degrees the private sector pays more????

As for those lower level workers the solution seems obvious...go apply for a government job!

hey to all the repubs out there, lets do another reagan. lets fire all the air traffic controllers again, have companies bid on manning the towers, and then hire the lowest bidder. that should save the gov billions. everyone knows all they do is sleep, and anyone can talk on a mike. the FAA stated that "its no more stressfull than driving a bus"

To whomever asked "Do you even know what most government employees do?" My answer would be look at porn. Seems that is what the SEC does when banks are fraudulently stealing my 401k that is now gone, like my job. How about drugs, prostitutes and corporate whores for the MMS? Then most of these government employees quit their fed jobs and take the nice cushy one for the corporation they just got the license or laws passed for, isn't that right Ex- Senator Dodd, with the MPAA?

This is funny.....

You made the choice to work in the private sector, while I made the choice to serve my country. And most of you don't even have a clue what a Federal Employee makes. Plus it's not my fault, that the only job you can do is "Welcome to Wal-Mart" or "Would you like to super-size that Big Mac?"

Here are some examples for you

Entry level GS-1 makes from $ 17,803 and has a ten step level to $ 22,273

Mid-level GS-7 makes from $ 33,979 and again has a ten level to $ 44,174

GS-15 (top level) $ 90,628 to $ 129,518 and it don't go any higher.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/23929224/Salary-Table-2010-Gs

I didn't get paid overtime when I worked 60 - 65 hour weeks, or double time when I worked on holidays.

As to the govenrment regulations - 99% of them were the result of people and corporations taking "short-cuts, or just plain greedy".

When ENRON colapsed, we got the SOX Act - where a 3rd party had to reveiw the books, and now Wall Street is bitching thats cost to much money and we can regulate ourselfs - trust us.

And the big target is now the dept of energy, because it is in the way of the big oil and coal of making their greedy profit and destroying the environment with strip mining, toxic run off.

I'm tired of people bashing our government employees. What, are you jealous? What about 10 years ago when you private employees were gloating about how much money you made? How you gleeflully told your government employed friend about the big bonus you got that year? Did I work for the government? Yes. Did I work hard? Yes. Did I turn down the opportunity to triple my pay in the private sector so I could retire with a modest retirement? Yes. What stopped you from applying for a government job?

To the person who knows all these people who are earning 6 figures in retirement, yes, there are those who spiked the system, but they are a small percentage of your overall government retirees, 98% of the rank and file usually retire with less than $25K a year.

So when they fire 50% of the public sector people, you will complain about poor service, your kids will be in class rooms with 40 kids and unable to learn, your house may burn down because the fire station down the street was closed and the next time someone robs your house, there won't be a police officer to even take the report or respond let alone retrieve your stolen goods. Someone stiffs you in a deal, well, sorry, the courts are only doing criminal cases and small claims or civil courts are so backed up that it will take 5 years or more to even get a court date. Oh, and when you line up for unemployment, sorry, it will take at least 6 months to process your claim.

Think about it folks.

Ignorantly stating all federal employees are worthless is very naive. I am proud to say I work for FAA and, along with my co-workers, contribute to the air safety for the flying public. We work very hard and many of are compensated less than our counterparts in private industry. Our operational budgets have been cut so much over the years that we have had to find ways to do more with less. When positions are vacated other workers are expected to take on additional workload to cover. FAA implemented a pay system in 1999 that essentially capped and reduced pay. My salary has been cut by about 22% since 1999, and as our retirement is tied to that pay, my annuity will be significantly reduced. In addition to this, our pay has been frozen the last two years, and now we may expect another year. It is naive to assume we do nothing and are overpaid.

"Ignorant global comment - do you have any idea what most federal worker do??"

Based on friends who have worked in govt, local state and federal, not as much as a private sector employee in the same profession.

But hey, that's no reason not to pay them more! Oh wait.

Everyone seems to go after Federal workers, but not the lawmakers. Why should lawmakers get any taxpayer funded healthcare or pensions or give themselves raises? They are elected. The Federal worker is not elected. Lawmakers don't do this job for life, like the rest of us. They just go back to their former jobs. If they think that we can afford to pay for our own healthcare, they surely can too. They could go state to state, looking for a provider, like they want us to. Pre-existing condition? Suffer like the rest of us. Pay it out of your own pocket. You make more than us.

Far as federal workers making more, someone has to set the bar for everyone who makes less to at least have a chance to follow and fight inflation with a higher wage.. Without someone representing the middle class, there won't be a middle class. Why should federal workers take a pay cut? Non- federal workers should get a pay increase that fits inflation.

@Kenn the Dem

You're paying for it whether it is in the public or private sector. Otherwise, where would the money come from? The tooth fairy?

Anyone who thinks the private sector is necessarily more efficient has not been in an organization high enough or at corporate HQ long enough to see what REALLY happens.

If you make a claim, PROVE IT. Post your resume. Let us see if your opinions are backed by anything.

I believe you mean "Utopian-ize." The only one currently pitting one class against another is the Great Uniter, President Obama, who demonizes the rich with one hand while taking their donations with the other.

Daniel, you are too smart for this forum - they have these idiots just where they want them: where they fight downward and envy the little that others get. While they are fighting for crumbs the rich are syphoning BILLIONS out of the economy and buy their girlfriends $4,000 handbags and their wives new mansions.

Sure thing guys - we haven't sent enough jobs overseas in the last 30 years. If the EPA regulates carbon dioxide so that we all have to cut our breathing rate in half on the job and we all go to sleep then ALL the jobs can go overseas!! TADA! No more pollution, no need for energy. And best of all, the government can support us ALL! Sure hope the Chinese have lots of money to lend.

I believe you mean "Utopian-ize." The only one currently pitting one class against another is the Great Uniter, President Obama, who demonizes the rich with one hand while taking their donations with the other.

.....

Put yourself in an Ultra Wealthy CEOs shoes.

He's already against most American Citizens. Has been for decades. And the results? Increase in pay around 10 fold.

The mistake small businesses, entrepenaurs, and hard workers make is to think that if you just try hard enough, the people with the purse strings will recognize that and reward it.

Not in the current economic climate globally. Which demands driving wages, benefits, and standards lower so that a bit more can be *distributed* to very top.

They've been at war against you for a long time. The goal is to eliminate actual democracy and replace it as fully as possible with Corporate Feudalism.

@ScienceGoneMad -- Nice try but you have only proven yourself to be an ideologically out of touch thinker.

The President is calling for people in his own class to act more responsibly. Using your ideologically out of touch talking points - Obama is demonizing people as 'rich' as he is.

The 'liberal rich' are debating the 'conservative rich' about fairness - income inequality - responsibility to our society and our country. The 'liberal rich' are confident that they will remain 'rich' if they share with society. The 'conservative rich' lack that confidence.

While they are fighting for crumbs the rich are syphoning BILLIONS out of the economy and buy their girlfriends $4,000 handbags and their wives new mansions.

That is a very small portion of the wealthy most millionaires have never paid more than 30K for a car. and in fact most millionaires own a F-150 truck.

That's your idea of clever, eh? I noticed you did not address the President's eager willingness to take money from the rich for his campaign, which makes him two-faced on the issue. The President received more money from Big Banksters than all the other candidates combined. That makes him part of the problem, not part of the solution. Game. Set. Match!

@ScienceGoneMad -- President Obama did not force any one of those Big Banksters to donate to his campaign. The Big Banksters decided to donate to a presidential campaign whose message and governing priorities were publicized and known.

Using your ideologically out of touch logic - there are more 'liberal rich' than 'conservative rich' - since more donated to Obama than anyone else. Are you arguing that there are too many 'rich' people?

Or are you arguing you are simply not 'rich' enough to be 'liberal'? Maybe, someday, you could become 'rich' enough to be an Obama supporter, too.

The private sector, particularly small business is still in the ditch. Wages, profits and benefits simply can't compete with the Fed because this economy simply will not allow it. Federal compensation/benefits have always been good it's just that the private sector sucks.

The problem isn't that federal workers have better benefits, it's that the private sector's wages and benefits have been stagnant and decreasing (no COLA). We need the tide to raise all boats, not to subscribe to Teapublican "Race to the Bottom" negative and depressing world vision.

@true patriot...so who pays for those salaries that you believe need to be increased?

@Daniel Greco - The Federal Government has an endless supply of credit and taxpayers to bleed dry to pay those wages. Companies don't. They have to actually budget.

You have got to be a troll! Folks it's exactly the opposite! Unions and the Federal Government are killing the economy!

As a retired Federal employee I collect my retirement (a 401K type plan) and buy my health insurance. Wonder where all the perks are I'm supposed to be collecting. Also, as I worked for the Bureau of Prisons, I had to qualify in firearms and self-defense every year to keep my job. I had a complete background investigation every five years to keep my job. I could not be delinquent in my debts to keep my job (how many companies make that a requirement of employment?). I did not have strike benefits, the Union could not negotiate my pay (contrary to popular belief), our raises were COLAs, and when the govt. went broke we Federal employees still worked although without pay for several weeks (and I thought a war was fought to prevent mandatory servitude).

As for my early retirement, whether I wanted to or not, it also reduced the amount of retirement pay I would receive. And if I chose to start another career it would have a maximum earning ceiling or it would be taken from my Fed. retirement - yes the one I paid into and built - like everyone else.

Now if one considers getting rid of Fed. employees and just contracting them it doesn't work. The prison I worked at let some of the teachers jobs go with attrition. BUT, they needed teachers so they were contracted. The contracts worked only 6 hr. days, had to be babysat, and could do nothing outside of their contract whereas we Fed. employees would drop our jobs as needed and go on to the more critical job at hand.

As for those superhigh govt. wages, go to Jobs.gov and look at the rates. You'll not find it there.

Now maybe the private sector should insist that they receive a fair wage for themselves and their families and not begrudge others. And there were some lazy govt,. workers but there are in every profession. Surely everyone here working has someone from their job site that isn't work the paper his check is written on.

A well thought out intelligent point. Kudos!

I was in line at a CVS pharmacy. Some big dude was talking with the security guy at the pharmacy. The Security guard said he would be making twenty-two an hour if he was hired by the St Joesph, IN County jail. The big dude told him he was getting screwed. The big dude said he should be making allot more.

Frankly, the CVS security guy said it would be allot more than what he was making now. The big dude said that was nothing, he hadn't even finished his bachelors and he was making way more than that.

Two guys, one in the system wantin everything he can milk out of it. The other is just happy to be able to move up.

Don't know what else to say other than fire the big dude.

nerm-l, Sorry, your "logic" is flawed...

The 'liberal rich' are confident that they will remain 'rich' if they share with society. The 'conservative rich' lack that confidence

You generalize so broadly that your point can't be proved and you if you do try your own bias will get in the way.

President Obama did not force any one of those Big Banksters to donate to his campaign. The Big Banksters decided to donate to a presidential campaign whose message and governing priorities were publicized and known

Cool. This must mean that you have no problem in who or why someone contributes $$$ to any cause. Right?

Nicey....

The mistake small businesses, entrepenaurs, and hard workers make is to think that if you just try hard enough, the people with the purse strings will recognize that and reward it.

Really? Small businesses are looking to fill a market niche, provide a service or be more competitive than others in satisfying consumer demand. More of a "bottom up" type of cash flow.

The entreprenor believes that they have something that others want. Without capital their idea may never takeoff. That capital requirement will be supplied by those willing to risk the investment, be they financial institutions or individuals. Care to look up the % of small businesses that fail within the first two years of business?

Hard work is so nebulas. Are you talking about adding to your skill sets so that your boss takes notice that you are adding value or that you are just willing to put in the occassional overtime? I hope you realize that some work is only worth so much in order for the business to remain competitive.

Regardless, any business will pay you only the amount required to keep you from leaving.

As a former member of the U.S. Military, I don't have a problem with certain portions of the Federal work force making more than their civilian counterparts, especially those who go in harm's way.

Where I have a HUGE problem is with the FACT that the Federal work force simply hasn't had to deal with the reality of the Great Recession, with the exception of the military who are about to go through another reduction in force strength. That's just wrong.

I will not support ANY Presidential candidate who is not committed to across the board cuts of staffing and spending levels (which may need to include pay freezes) throughout the entire Federal Government. The cuts to the Department of Defense are a nice start but they need to be extended throughout our morbidly obese Federal Government !!

Good point. FDR, Economy Act of 1933, cut over 13.5% from Federal budget. Civilian and military workers, including members of Congress, had their pay cut. Nothing should be sacrosanct, and this executive branch act (6 days into FDR's 1st term) is a good template for what is needed at present.

Those who "can" work for private enterprise. Those who "can't" work for the government. Welcome to the new world, where everyone is a government employee, and we sink just like Greece is about to. The course that America is on is not sustainable.

Over the last 30 years productivity in the US has gone up over 40% while wages have only gone up 1.5%. Seems to me the government is the only employer that actually values its employees these days.

This article is not as well-researched as it appears and is definitely not objective. All due to the fact that it does NOT mention that after some point in the 1980's, all Federal Workers hired after that point no longer retire with a defined benefit pension plan, but a 401K like the rest of us. And their pay may be a bit above the private worker, but that is only because the private worker's pay has decreased so much over the past 10 years or so.

Don't allow this article to set us middle-class workers against each other. It is the outrageous CEO pay we should all be disgusted with.

Federal employee benefits are still the golden handcuffs. If a private sector employer tried to match them they would go bankrupt.

Really? Small businesses are looking to fill a market niche, provide a service or be more competitive than others in satisfying consumer demand. More of a "bottom up" type of cash flow.

Really? Small businesses are creating 80% of all jobs now in the US. Seems like more than just niche.

The entreprenor believes that they have something that others want. Without capital their idea may never takeoff. That capital requirement will be supplied by those willing to risk the investment, be they financial institutions or individuals.

Venture capital is responsible for maybe 0.0000001% of jobs created. The by far, vast majority, of the 22 million small businesses do not rely on venture capital at all.

They rely on lending institutions (banks, credit unions, etc).

The problem is, the access to capital is severely constrained. The impact of allowing less capital in the bottom 90% of households has been a negative. Because it lowers the amount of transactions that can occur, it lowers the velocity of money. Which is what actually "creates" GDP growth, not financial engineering, which is what most equity markets now do.

Hard work is so nebulas. Are you talking about adding to your skill sets so that your boss takes notice that you are adding value or that you are just willing to put in the occassional overtime? I hope you realize that some work is only worth so much in order for the business to remain competitive.

US worker productivity gains have been phenominal over the last 30 years. With almost *no real wage growth* in the same time (particularly if you consider loss of benefits, and paying more than ever for health care, it's actually negative wages).

Regardless, any business will pay you only the amount required to keep you from leaving.

Which is not capitalism. It really isn't.

The origin of industry would say, you have to pay workers a wage that allows them to save, produce a better family future, and thus afford the products being sold.

The current direction is one of demand that is curbed globally. You can't pay Chinese workers 0.30 an hour and expect to just keep selling more and more stuff.

But on more than just a consumption note, it's that lack of investment in the working class is a bad idea long term. It leads to lower economic success on the whole.

It's the working class where the new innovations come from, the saving for better lives, the spending to attain that, and so on. When the capital (wage capital specifically) isn't allowed to appreciate over time, you get far weaker economies and societies.

(Which is what is happening, we're losing social cohesion).

Banksters and all big businesses donate to both sides cuz they understand that if you're not at the table, you're on the menu. It doesnt matter which side they're buying. They understand how to play the game and that's how/why they got rich.

Article on how federal employees are getting paid more then private sector workers...

Reaction: Instead of demanding higher pay for private sector workers to raise our economy we demand lower pay for federal employees to lower us all.

To the chap with the cute little "those who can work for private enterprise. Those who can't work for government" quip, you couldn't have hacked what I did for my three plus years on active duty in the U.S. Army AT ANY AGE, whether you were in your late teens/ early twenties or mid forties (as I was). Not the initial training, not the overhaul of a motorpool neglected during a year plus deployment, not the four months of field rotation in preparation for deployment and certainly not a 14 month Iraq deployment, five months (the FIVE HOTTEST MONTHS from May through September) of which was spent living in tents in the desert near the Iranian border !!

NEVER DOUBT the abilities,stamina and can do spirit of the warriors of our U.S. Military, because without their sacrifices. THERE WOULD BE NO private enterprise !!! While there is plenty of dead wood throughout or bloated government, there are also those who go way beyond the call of duty in every department. I might agree with that quote and lord knows the Federal Government (including the military) is past due for a major reduction in force, but the fact is not everyone who serves our nation is a loser, whether military or civilian, and that quip makes no distinctions.

it didn't

your tax dollars paid for it.

It's not necessarily the "pay & benefits" in some cases but the stability of the job. There is a lot of uncertainty in corporate America today. Look at the number of companies laying off workers, filing for bankruptcy, or being bought out by another company. That kind of instability is what drives folks to look at federal jobs.

Purple Turtle - The headline is misleading - if you read the entire article it says people who have lower education get more than same jobs in the private sector.

However, people with higher degrees are paid less than the private sector

I know you like to validate your belief system that government workers are milking the system - however get all the facts before you sound off

Not to mention the private sector pays keep decreasing each years because most private sectors can pay much cheaper than before or they can just fire people and get someone else who willing to work for lower wages.

I have my hubby's W-2 in hand.... Federal income tax, social security, medicare tax, state income tax, health care premium, and pension plan were all deducted from paycheck. Fed employees are taxpayers too. Spending their paychecks in the communities they live in. The local dry cleaners, the grocer, barber shop, the mom and pop pizza place, and the quicki-mart.

I haven't figured out what the "generous benefits" are that posters are referring to. He has the same benenfits he had in the private sector and he pays for them. Pay increase when moving from the private sector to the federal was negligible (didn't even cover the cost of the moving truck). After an increased state income tax to relocate where the federal job was, and a hideous cost of living in the area, we are worse off than before.

As stated by RetiredUSAF, the allure of a fed job is simply the aura of job security.

And yet he still works hard, striving to stand out and exceed expectations everyday, hoping to elude the budget axe when it falls (we don't doubt for a moment it will) the same as he did in the private sector.

@PurpleTurtle

....duh. Why else would federal jobs be so wanted, between better pay and benefits

Uh...you're kidding...right? I was a GS-5 working for the VA. I made almost nothing in pay and the benefits (i.e. healthcare) were a joke. I had GEHA and they paid out next to nothing. Unless you're a GS-10 and above, you're screwed.

Jaede2843

There is no job security in federal jobs. In many cases you have a one year probationary period and a background check. You can literally be fired on a whim for the most innocuous offenses. So you have to sweat it out and be a slave for a year before they hire you. Most private jobs are direct to hire at the least, maybe 6 months at the most.

To summarize, smart people do better in the private sector, mediocre people do better in govt who pays them generously with other peoples' money. Duh.

@Barbara Adams - I'm not sure how you got that I thought this from my comment:

I know you like to validate your belief system that government workers are milking the system - however get all the facts before you sound off

But, I was not saying they were milking the system at all. And, I did read the entire article...
Also, for the record - I agree whole-heartedly that military workers do not get paid nearly enough.

And @alexinPA -

it didn't

your tax dollars paid for it.

Yep, my tax dollars did pay for it. The government used them to pay for it....

I don't think it's news to "people" I think it's news to federal people and the government. LOL

just another reason why our "FEDERAL" deficit is 15 1/2 TRILLION! It's easy to spend/waste other peoples' money....the taxpayers.

You mean debt.

The article didn't mention much about the study. But it says...

A new government study says the average federal worker earns about 2 percent more than a private sector worker in a comparable profession

What exactly does that entail?

In general, federal workers (ex-post office) recieve more because they are more likely to have degrees, certifications, and more experience than private sector counterparts *even in comparable professions*

Obviously those who are more highly skilled will be attracted to higher pay, and higher benefits.

People tend to start going on and on about unions, but the big one (the teachers union) doesn't apply because they aren't federal employees.

Why is the government wrong to want to pay for the best Treasury employees? The best CIA operatives? The best FBI agents? The best economic analysts? They have to compete with private industry to employ those people.

So what you are saying is that two unfunded and poorly planned land wars in Asia have nothing at all to do with the deficit?

Neither do the poorly timed and ill-advised tax cuts?

If you take out George W. Bush's signature 'accomplishments', our deficit picture wouldn't be perfect, but it would be a lot better than it is.

The Federal Government doesn't attract the "best" of anything. The Treasury Dept, the SEC. Really? It's a revolving door. They are either time servers or manipulating the "system".

@ The Beev - I have read tons of posts on there claiming that fed employees make far less than the private sector and rely on the generous benefit packages to make up for it.

The federal deficit is not because of the government employees. Please get a CLUE!!! The deficit is there because $4 Trillion dollars were spent on the 2.5 wars since 2001, and in order to not go into a depression the banks were loaned around $9 Trillion dollars.

Your taxes didn't go up to pay for the war -- something that has never been done before, and most of the money to the banks still needs to be accounted and returned with interest.

Think about it...

@Nicey-1026620 - If the government pays for degrees or certifications they need to raise there hiring standards.

If they actually pay for experience, which is highly unlikely, than they have done a good job.

Private sectors keep paying less or they get people who willing to work for less.

As for debt, you do know that government lent money to banks with ZERO INTEREST and banks lent money back to government with interests.

This is like you lend money to your friends and when you need money, they will lend you back that same money and you have to pay them interest with the money you lend them in the first place. BIGGEST SCAM EVER.

who else?

Realist: the civil service system is stacked against a manager who wants to reprimand let alone get rid of an employee. They have to appear before boards, consultants, arbitration, withstand accusations of unfairness, write endless reports and justifications and then the agency will just try to pay off the employee with a promotion if they agree not to sue just to avoid the trouble. If the rules are changed then you could start to reduce the slag in the workforce.

So when you factor in that the lazy government worker is doing 50% of the work the private sector worker does, most would still make more $.

Whatever the problem, government is always the worst possible way to do it. Perhaps necessary like police or fire, but always the worst.

LB, as a lowly GS-5 federal worker I work my ass up to move up that ladder just as much as I would if I were in the private sector.

I'd love for you to come tell me I'm lazy to my face.

It's easy to make such ignorant comments when one isn't faced with actual reality.

Get a clue jerk.

What does it matter what Federal employees make? Once we offshored our tax base we cannot afford them anyway. It is time to live within our means even if that means getting rid of these (incredibly cheap) Federal Employees!

TV's are incredibly cheap, yet I still have my old projection set. It matters what we can afford, not what they cost!

I pay $0.00 in tax these days since my small business is losing money due to lack of demand. Soon I will have to go on the Obama plan and file bankruptcy. That should REALLY help Federal employees!

Stop blaming the federal government workers for everything,you jealous you don't have a government job. We may make more but we pay much higher taxes an our benefits especially health benefits is a lot higher in cost. So if you average in all that we make about the same as private sectors . Do the math before you write stupid comments cause if you are not a federal worker you don't know @!$%#

Have you guys notice the wages of private sector recently? It keeps going down and if you don't accept it, they will fire you to get someone's else who willing to work for less.

Private sectors are all for profit and the one that get the short end of the stick are the people who work for them.

LB-3426829

So when you factor in that the lazy government worker is doing 50% of the work the private sector worker does, most would still make more $.

For someone to state such a concise number like that - you obviously have some source for it right?

"work my ass up" ???? I guess Josh isnt in a profession that requires writing skills.

Like Josh- I am a GS5 for the federal govt and am not even the slightest bit lazy! if everyone is so curious about Federal jobs and how much we make go to the Federal job website and check it out USAJOBS.gov. You may really be surprised! As a GS5 i make less than 30,000 a year which is the same that i made working in the private sector and i pay more for my insurance. MY retirement package is only minimally better that the private sector. People who work for the govt work just as hard and long hours and pay taxes
(usually half of my paycheck goes right back to uncle Sam) just like everyone else in America. When the Govt threatens to shut down as it has several times recently guess who doesnt get a paycheck? Federal employees thats who. If the govt does indeed shut down we are unable to make house,car and utility payments and have no idea where the next weeks groceries will come from just like anybody else who loses a paycheck. There is no plan for a back up unless you have enough savings to cover everything. The real problem is with politician who after serving one term have a pension and free insurance for life.

Like Josh- I am a GS5 for the federal govt and am not even the slightest bit lazy! if everyone is so curious about Federal jobs and how much we make go to the Federal job website and check it out USAJOBS.gov. You may really be surprised! As a GS5 i make less than 30,000 a year which is the same that i made working in the private sector and i pay more for my insurance. MY retirement package is only minimally better that the private sector. People who work for the govt work just as hard and long hours and pay taxes
(usually half of my paycheck goes right back to uncle Sam) just like everyone else in America. When the Govt threatens to shut down as it has several times recently guess who doesnt get a paycheck? Federal employees thats who. If the govt does indeed shut down we are unable to make house,car and utility payments and have no idea where the next weeks groceries will come from just like anybody else who loses a paycheck. There is no plan for a back up unless you have enough savings to cover everything. The real problem is with politician who after serving one term have a pension and free insurance for life.

yep

Guess you'll be saying hi to your new President Calderon when you move to Mexico. The G O P don't have anyone with enough brains to come in out of the rain running for president so Obama will still be the president in 2013

People - please tell me you understand that most, by far most, federal employees were not hired by Obama. I'm sad for so many of you.

@Professional Fed

You are talking to deaf ears here, they will blame Obama for everything that happen. Even things that happened 10 to 20 years ago, it's still Obama fault.

I guess it also Obama's fault that private sector pays less wages than before to get more profit and that is also one of the reason for this article.

This about the fundamental structural failings of govt. Obama is only the latest temp worker to be in charge of it. <insert "new boss" quote here>

All Fed jobs get benefits and most benefits are at a low rate because of the huge number of employees that allows the Fed to get discounts that

I don't know if that's the case.

Just because a company has so many employees doesn't necessarily allow it to negotiate better with insurance. It's really dependent on the risk pool (at least, the way the insurance companies are set up).

In fact, the government is paying very high rates because health costs continue to rise dramatically and it typically covers more than private employers.

If the markets were actually free, individuals could negotiate for better rates often times than the group rate.

If the government did not interfere in everything the way it does costs for healthcare and higher education and housing would be much more affordable!

You're partly right. By the time the taxpayers pick up the tab for the government employees benefits, they don't have enough left to fund their own.

we pay taxes. Good God, man - don't embarrass yourself.

Government Workers pay taxes and they also pay alot for their health benifits! Something the general population knows nothing about. People just need to become more educated and actually think about things, not just believe something because it was written in an article.

ssmike

If the government did not interfere in everything the way it does costs for healthcare and higher education and housing would be much more affordable!

Right - its the governments fault that health care costs so much. ROFL! Clowns!

you know what they say about economist?

they are great at predicting past results.

"Private Employers Pay EVEN LESS Than the Federal Government"

it just depends on the job. I know people in the Army that leave and get paid 30-50K more then when they were in. My wife could make 20K more then she does now.

alexinPA - Postal workers do not work for the government but are overseen by the government even though some in congress think they do - I guess that's why they stole $5 Billion from their pension fund and now want to privatize the Postal Service

Just like the Republicans want to privatize everything from SS to Medicare

Actually Medicare and SS only cost 3% to administer just think how much if privatized

Yeah the SS office and Post Officer are the only government jobs right? Get a clue to what you are actually talking about.

Most of these federal workers are in the Military. The reason the soldiers get paid more now is because corporate greed has sucked our country dry. One of the biggest scams is a 401k. The 401k has replaced pensions in the private sector. They are sold to you as a way to retirement, when in reality, they are a way for corporations to make you work longer with no hopes of retirement. It simply gets the companies out of paying pensions so they can give the big wigs higher bonuses and salaries. I have never heard of anyone retiring off of a 401k, and I have not or will not ever have one. My wife will not get out of the military until she secures a pension. A fix for this would to make a maximum wage to balance the minimum wage. This would force the companies to reinvest in the US. It would open tons of jobs, not to mention cut the hours of overworked employees. Less hours=less stress=less healthcare cost. Greed is suffocating this country. Our huge imbalance of wealth is sad.

Federal workers are not military personnel. Entirely two different groups. Speak only of what you know (and that goes for the rest of your comments, as well). I'm really amazed to read the comments here. Only a very few posters know the true picture of the Federal worker pay and retirement systems.

I am also in the Federal system but not always. I spent 26 years in the private sector and the last 3 years in Fed. I was making $48,000 when i left the private sector as a truck driver. I am currently a GS-7 making less than 40,000 working at a desk. People, it really depends on who you work for in the private sector. I started as a GS-5 and needed a degree to get the GS-7 I am now so i went back to school and got my bachelors degree.

Not all areas have jobs available but i have seen hiring signs in some areas. i know people who are looking for work but refuse to work fast food etc. Some money is better than no money yes?

great post.

socialism doesn't work... the money eventually runs out.

Wealthy? You have got to be joking me.

yep - just an factless post that is spun to point of hate of federal workers..

Would be good to debate/discuss facts versus "soundbite/blog bites" - not likely tohappen in our short attention span world and articles with no depth or clear methods exposed

easy enough to truly research federal compensation and retirement benefits over time at the OPM site. Fedral compensation and rules are public and there for the reading..........................

Federal employees hired prior to 1984 were in a different retirement system called CRCS than todays FERS system employees -- CRCS employees contributed about 7-8 percent of pay to their retirement and government contributed as well and these folks are not part of social security -- like some railroad workers and some state employees

In 1984, the FERS system shifted new hires to a new program with a 401K program, plus shifted workers to pay into SS + contribute to a smally annuity program that can earn them about 1% of high three salary after 5 years of vestment at age 62. BTW - want to complain - congress earns 1.7% per year on much higher salaries for this FERS annuity (federal police and firefighters also have the 1.7% annuity build up per year) -- this is not a big amount of money, but can be a hiring and retention perk. earliest someone can get this annuity is about age 55 years with 10 years (there is a penalty for getting this prior to age 62) - most will get this after 20-30 years of service and after age 62.

BTW - the military retirement system was changed about this same time in the 80's

Result was a reduced retirement benefit compared to past systems..

FERS is comparable in many ways to several compensation packages you would see in the private sector - 401K, SS -- small other benefit pieces beyond these - Feds have no stock options and other perks to offer

The FERS annuity helps a small amount recruit/retain quality folks with advanced degrees since overal compensation over time is lower, but some can do the long haul math and decide if they wish to work for Feds... We still still a fair number of folks come in as workers and gain lots of skills and training in a few years and jump to the private sector and earn much more than they would have had they stayed in the FEDS.

The Healthcare group insurance for federal employee (non military) is very similar to many large company health care insurance group offerings to include comparable premiums

Bottom-line -- I know it will not blunt the factless rants, but the rants against the federal workforce is misplaced and was stated earlier - in many cases folks shoul be more concerned with exploitation of the workers in the private sector that are not really given a fair compensation for the work they do for company x or y.

Dr. T

Sounds exactly like the double speak I hear from the likes of president Obama and Barney Frank and John Kerry!

ssmike - The only DOUBLESPEAK I ever hear is from you!

Yes Privet your pay is too much so instead of 17K a year we will be cutting it by 15% and pay you about 15K a year. now go to Bosnia for 3 years.

I have never called anyone a name in any of my posts here. I'm going to make an exception today for AlexinPa... You don't know what you're talking about and you should quit while you're ahead.. Because your comments are garbage and you sir are ignorant.. Crawl back in the basement and stay there until you come up with some facts..

Wow, Alex. What a super-informed comment. Clearly, based on your obvious lack of intelligence, you wouldn't qualify for a government job, where the vast majority have Bachelor's degrees and many have Master's and Ph.D.'s.

So, do us all a favor and go crawl back into your hole in Pennsyltucky.

The DC area federal workers generally get more pay for the same job than the folks in other parts of the country.

DC is a higher cost of living area.

All of them do 50% as much as someone with a "real" job, they just don't know it yet because they've been so coddled. . If they get canned from the government, and I certainly hope they do, wait until they have to compete with private sector workers. It'll be a quick trip to the bottom of the resume pile as soon as they see you worked for the government.

Stoney, MMChief--Thanks. We should also tell them to go to the OPM web site or USAjobs.gov and take a look at the requirements for jobs such as: GS-512 and GS-1811. I doubt most of these posters could qualify for those jobs on the entry level, pass through the early phases of training, make to OJT and then on the Journeyman level of the jobs.

Jake in Chicago Senior Agent 36 yrs IRS Field Agent

@Jake...if the US tax code wasn't so complex, we wouldn't need that many intellects employed by the IRS.

Yeh right. We're from the Gov. and we are here to help you. That translates to bend over and grab your ankles.

You went from one government job to another? I can't wait until you have to do an honest days work. It'll be quite a shock.

The study doesn't mention that if you went to work for the federal government since 1986 you aren't on a federal retirment system. You get social security, just like everyone else. You can contribute to a TSP (Thrift Savings Plan) which is similar to a 401 k in the private sector. Federal retirement is highly overrated by those who know nothing about it.

You aren't the first poster to inaccurately state this. A retired federal worker on FERS (hired since 1986) will get a basic annuity computed based on length of service and "high-3" average salary plus TSP (401 K), plus Social Security and if not Social security eligible at the time of retirment a FERS annuity supplement to make up for it.

As a self employed person I contribute the first seventeen parcent of every dollar earned toward social security then pay for you! Stop your whining!

Amen! Part of the 15.3% club as well...

wow it sure is obvious how jealous people are who don't work for the Gov't. Maybe you have already applied and you didn't get in. Keep talking it down and remember all the agencies that are working to make your air, water, etc better. If you don't like our Gov't, go to one of the Arab or African countries where there are no rights for most people. betcha you would change your mind quick.

Maybe they remind you of this because you're doing a lousy job in the first place?

Everybody has a boss...stop whining about it.

Lets take the Government out of everything. Then when anything goes wrong we can all get $500.00an hour attorneysand go to court and let the big business take us all to the cleaners. We won't have anybody but HOA keeping are streets clean and we will pay for that by the amount they want to charge us and if we don't like that we can take them to court and pay their lawyer and ours, don't forget we can all carry our garbage to the dump and pay them by the pound to dispose of it if there is a dump, water if it is drinkable you might just afford it. Food well maybe you will eat it if you know what type of meat it is. Don't expect streets to drive on, Plains hope you don't want to get on one might not have been checked in the last couple of years. Laws their are none your kids that young daughter of yours and son that you say got raped or molested Schools for teaching. Remember their is no Military. Oh I see you only want small Government and only to take care of the other guy and you want them to work for cheep because they don't do what you think they should do. What any Government agency does is follow the laws that allow it to operate it cannot work out side of it's jurisdiction no matter how much YOU want it to. So when you ask an Agency for help and it tells you it can't most likely it does not have the LAWS to back up the ability to enforce your claim and has given you hopefully some type of direction where to get help.

Because you work at least 15% less than us private sector people. You went from one government job to another. Get a real job and you'll understand.

LB, I'm disgusted at your comments, I recently moved from private to public and I easily am expected to work twice as hard as I did previously. I come home stressed and then get to see idiots like you spew complete BS.

LB I have bought products, food, clothing, cars, technology (T.V., Radios, Stereos, Cameras, VCR, VHS, Records) I've got to tell you some of the people who you think work 15% harder need to take a 50% pay cut. I would put the worst Government worker up against the worst private worker and I bet you would get 100% more production out of the Government worker doing the same job in1/2 the amount of time. The private sector is the reason this economy is in such bad shape. It is the private Banks, Real Estate Agents, Appraisers, Lenders, Investors, Business, and buyers and sellers that did this. You may say the Government did nothing, what the Government did, is doing nothing. Fannie and Freddie didn't do this by themselves.

Don't even waste your breathe on the comments from LB-3426829 since obviously all they like to do is feel sorry themselves b/c they aren't working a job that they like or can't find a job b/c they are an A— — .

AMEN!!!

totally untrue

You have to pay into Social Security to collect -- what you collect is based on earning that were subject to SS tax as paid by you and your employer

Old CRCS retiirement FEDS did not pay into SS, but contributed about 8% to the retirement system and do not collect SS based on any CRCS based earnings. to get social security they would have to have SS taxed earning from another job or jobs with a combined set of 40 quarters of earnings at minimum

current FERS based employees pay the same SS tax as everyone else and can collect from SS in the end..

Dr T

I believe they collect out and pay onto a different plan!

No Federal workers, hired after 1986, pay just as much into SS as any other worker. Such ignorant comments from uninformed people.

As a Fed in CSRS, If I do get enough quarters to receive Social Security it will be greatly reduced because of my federal pension.

Stoney is correct--in CSRS we don't contribute to Social Security, just 7.5 to 8% of salary into CSRS--no cap on pay for contributions as in SS.

Jake in Chicago 36 yrs IRS Senior Agent

FWE11--"You believe" Maybe you should do a little research and find out!!! It's not hard it just takes a little work but maybe because you work in the private sector you can't take a few minutes to become informed. It's easier to listen to the article or people who post things they know nothing about.

You're wrong. You have to pay into SS to collect. I work for the VA, I pay into SS as well as my own 401K. Get your facts straight

not a fan of congress and what they are doing or not doing, but your rant on how their retirement and healthcare benefits work is wrong

Congress members are either part of the old CRCS or FERS retirement systems - neither system provider "full salary for life" There is no "free healthcare for life"

FERS requires 5 years to have a small annutiy vestment - so a senator with a single six year term - would have 1.7% x high 3 salary avg x 6 for an annuity at age 62 + whatever they put in their 401K (government like some companies matches 401K to 5%) + social security

can debate what congress earns or not, but should use facts - not made up BS

can see all this my search the OPM website

Stoney, don't forget that a senator or congressperson are also allowed to take their "war chests" when they leave. When did they begin to contribute to Social Security?

Allison, Senators and Representatives began contributing to Social Security with the birth of FERS. See posts above

Jake in Chicago 36yrs IRS Senior Agent

The army is cutting more than 10% of it's "dead weight".

Did you read the part that total compensation was $200B? So your 10% would cut $20B. Call that a huge impact?

Don't believe these lies the GOP is putting out there. My husband is a federal worker and we pay out $800 a month into healthcare. I would bet most of the government worker bashers don't pay close to this.Also, no one in the private sector does his job keeping lame ass GOPers safe when they fly Also, the great thing about the government is they pay higher if the cost of living is high, like here on Long Island but it is NOT an excessive salary and we are certainly not living it up. The rich should be taxes at a higher bracket, problem solved

Susan,

Ooooh. $800/mo. Whoopie.

My wife and I pay $2500+/month for $5000 deductable insurance. That's what insurance costs in the real world.

By the way, that's not your hated GOP, that's your overpaid CBO - populated mainly by undertalented liberals who are painting that picture.

If you want to know what the conservatives are saying, do a search on Andrew Biggs.

Economan,

Actually $800 for an employee who works for a company that has benefits is about right. Your payment of $2500 per month ($30,000 annually) sounds excessive and could be that you are in business for yourself although a private practice lawyer neighbor of mine only pays $18,000 annully so you may need to do some shopping.

Cheers!

The city I work for, it costs 500 per month for the family plan.

Anyone paying $ 2,500 per month is being ripped off or just pulling numbers out of the air.

I don't take the plan offered by the city, since I am retired military and get TRICARE and my premium is ZERO per month.

Maybe if you got off your arse and served your country for 30 years then you wouldn't be paying $ 2,500 per month for health insurance. But no your choice was to take the "easy way" where you got paid overtime and got to go home every night. I can't even count the number of work days that were 36 hours long and the people that "really didn't like you" could rob you of the few hours of sleep with rocket attacks.

well said cmcmark and AL-1735815. Economan needs to do some insurance shopping or quit your bitchin'.