The Beev...Those red light cameras are hauling in millions. NJ has installed them everywhere. I passed 2 on my way to work this morning and watched the yellow flash to red in less than 3 seconds. This means they are set so that they can force drivers to either stop on the green before it turns yellow or else you go through the yellow and get a ticket. How is that not dangerous? You slam on your brakes to avoid the yellow and you get rear ended.

Not only that but everyone needs to be aware that those cameras are computerized to the max. If you get one ticket when you are snared between that yellow and red light, the camera's memory has you in there for life. So it can then bring up your license plate number from memory each time you are at an intersection. How is that not entrapment?

What surprises me, is that people didn't realize or think about this sooner. (Well, not really) They haven't just started using social networking sites for collecting debts. I'm sure it's been going on longer than people think. Putting your personal information out there, thinking it's only going to be seen by your friends as long as you set it to private, is just ridiculous. Putting your info out there and not thinking that there may be someone out there looking for you that you don't want to be found by, is just plain ignorant. Wake up people, or grow some brains!

This means they are set so that they can force drivers to either stop on the green before it turns yellow or else

IF you go the speed limit you want have that problem.

Auto...Another wiseass Know it All? You can be doing 25 mph with a green ahead of you and then it changes to yellow as you are in the intersection. It has nothing to do with doing speed limits. Get a clue would you?

Those red light cameras do not ticket people whose car entered the intersection on a yellow light. They do have a second or two "grace period". You pretty much have to run the light dead red to get ticketed. Also, these cameras cost some municipalities more to operate than the revenue they are bringing in. The cameras are maintained by private companies that get a percentage of each ticket issued and the cities have contracts to pay them for the maintenance, not to mention the cost of installing them. Each one costs over $80,000.00! Also, lots of people are contesting the tickets and getting off. You see, the photo only shows the license plate # and the vehicle. It can not get a picture of who is driving. The owner of the vehicle simply goes to court and says "I was not driving the car at that time, it was my brother, child, spouse, etc." The judges are throwing out the tickets as it can't be proven who was actually driving the vehicle. Remember this line of defense if you ever get one of these tickets!

Here's a nutty idea: Borrow money? Pay it back on time. And, don't borrow more than you can pay back on time. Shocking concept.

Blaming the bill collectors for the bad behavior of the borrowers is typical of an entitlement mentality. She probably falls into the 47% that don't pay income taxes, too.

Shocking concept-that the company you work for can all of a sudden lay you and everyone you work with to put the work in a foreign country. Shocking concept-some 70% of bankruptcies now filed are for medical bills, and people are still harrassed by the collection agencies after the bankruptcy is complete. And most of the entities not paying income taxes in this country are large corporations.

Blueunicorn: And your point is what, everyone is a victim and has no control over their life? Maybe if these folks had saved up some money instead of buying Iphones, beer, cable, cigarettes, an affordable home, etc. they wouldn't be living paycheck to paycheck.

Now THAT is a shocking concept.

cookiekamp...Good one. Here in NJ, some municipalities got a little too overzealous and began ticketing people turning right on a red light which in NJ is legal. I know this because one guy I work for had to go to court to fight the ticket.

In NJ, you don't dare not fight the ticket. Court costs are astronomical and then the insurance companies jack your auto insurance which in NJ is mandatory. So, a $45 ticket can end up being $1100 for doing 27 in a 25 mph zone. Kinda smells like collusion doesn't it?

norm...You get into an auto accident and are in a body cast. You can save up for that? You can save up for that $100,000 hospital bill on an annual salary of $60,000 a year? The average for most US workers?

How much have you saved for that hip and knee replacement you'll eventually need or do you plan to go the wheelchair route? How about a quadruple bypass? Or congenital diabetes? Now there's one you'd better save your entire paycheck for the next 25 years for.

Hey Norm - Here's an even nuttier idea. Your wife wakes up in the morning shivering, feverish, and with 1 breast as red as an apple. Go to the doctor and before the day is over give the doctor $2,000. (Oh yeah, we have insurance - through work, the best plan they offer!) And by the time the episode was over it was over $4,000.

I was fortunate, I had it - this time. But there are only so many events that I can handle wihout becoming on of those paycheck to paycheck people.

Gotta go! I need to tell my wife to get a little better control over her life

I didn't want to get into Red Light Cameras - But here is something I know you have NEVER heard.

The sensors that detect vehicles in the intersection and make the camera snap a picture -

CAN ALSO BE USED TO EXTEND THE YELLOW LIGHT WHEN CARS ARE IN THE INTERSECTION.

That would prevent wrecks and save lives.

Of course, the Gov't and the Camera companies don't make any money preventing wrecks and saving lives - so it will probably never happen.

Also -

1. Any punishment must be handled in a criminal court in the US as per the Constitution. Even when the punishment is solely monetary. You are guaranteed your choice of Judge or Jury trial.

So they can't just send you a ticket in the mail without giving you the option to dispute it in court.

2. It is well documented that the yellow light times are shortened on red light camera intersections. This is very dangerous - and the discrepancy between the yellow times at non camera intersections and camera intersections is disturbing.

3. In a civil case you can pass liability to the owner of a vehicle from the driver of the vehicle. You cannot do that in criminal court. That's why they don't use the courts for these tickets. You would have to ticket the driver, not the owner.

And speaking of civil court - in civil court you have to state your damages - if someone runs a red light, and no wreck occurs - then what are the actual monetary damages to the city? That would be none - but the Judge could triple that.

That is why they don't use Civil Courts for normal police officer tickets (forget the defying the Constitution thing - Gov't thinks it's above rules) - because you have no damages when someone is just speeding.

RyaninTexas...Things must be different in your state than mine. A cop pulls you over in NJ for failure to wear your seat belt and he marks the ticket with an "X" to show you don't have to appear in court. In NJ, traffic tickets are a huge industry. They've got it all down to a science. They know that no one is going to jeopardize their job to run to court to fight a $45 for failure to wear your seat belt or using a handheld cell phone while driving.

The ticket gives you that option but usually when the cop X's the "no appearance required", all they want is the money. The last traffic ticket I got was a real doozy. I was in the right lane of a major highway attempting to turn off at the next jughandle. Some jerk in a huge white SUV swerved into my lane forcing me onto that stupid white line that determines the jughandle lane ahead. $65 later and an slight increase in my insurance I no longer use that jughandle. Sorry, not going to make a profit off me when my property taxes are already through the roof.

Jimbob , sorry to hear about your wife and I hope everything turns out alright. Nonetheless, for every situation you describe there are 99 others like the one I described.

Event: what is your point? Is it you are entitled to free medical care? What about other life necessities, should they be free, too? We need food but it's not free. We need shelter, but it's not free. We need electric, gas, and water, but they're not free. Why medical care? What is so special about that? Why not everything else.

The article in question is about a $362 dollar bill. There is no reason she can't pay it. What you describe is something else altogether. Get a grip.

The debt collectors need to get judgements against the deadbeats.

Then it's a matter of public record - and you can post it anywhere, anytime.

Let's be honest - we are talking about people who enjoyed something but then wouldn't pay.

Try it at your local gas station or cafe - and the police come to take you away.

We don't need more protections for people who won't pay their debts - we need less.

So what if your neighbor knows you are a deadbeat? If it's that big of a deal to you THEN PAY THE MONEY YOU OWE!

Why do we protect people who owe money?

It doesn't make any sense. Actual harassment is one thing - but that is a pretty high bar. One call a day isn't harassment when you owe money.

Do you like your credit card rates? Just think, you pay quite a bit extra so that someone else doesn't have to be inconvienced by being reminded they owe money. Non-payment is the single largest expense for credit card companies.

So guess who pays again -the responsible people who practice personal responsibility.

Once again the Gov't steals food from the ants and gives it to the grasshoppers.

Norm - Well, I was out of work for 6 months, living on my husbands salary and what little bit I received from unemployement. I was already living paycheck to paycheck before I was laid off. During that time my bills fell behind, I paid what I had to, to live, and keep my kids healthy. Well guess what I have plenty of bill collectors calling me, know that I have a job I am trying to catch things up but it is a slow process. Unfortunatly most bill collectors want payment right then, but I don't have extra to give yet. $362 to me right now is like a million, not gonna happen. How nice that you have financial resources that allow you to pay all your bills. How nice that you have not had to look at a bill and say pay it? or feed your kids? That is what I still go through and many others who have been laid off or are dealing with medical crisis right now go through. Grow a heart.

Debit collectors are required to be bastard-coated bastards. It's practically in the job description.

@Ryan from Texas I disagree about consumers needing less debit protection. However, I don't think that they need more protection either. I think that the debit protections are fine right where they are and don't need to change. The only thing that needs to change is the level to which consumers and lenders both educate themselves about these protections and adhere to the law concerning these issues. As it stands there is plenty of blame to go around on both sides because there are plenty of lenders and borrowers who are sheisty and think they can get away with things that they shouldn't.

My point is that YOU don't necessarily know what caused any of the people mentioned in the article to wind up in the shape they were in. I get tired of the self-righteous nitpickers in these threads. Did you know there are collection company scams in this country that get copies of old debts that were paid off years ago and try to re-collect the monies that were paid? They use info from years back so that people who don't keep 7 years or more of copies of cancelled checks can't prove they paid. It happened to a couple I know and it took them 2 years of dealing with the harrassment before they were able to get it resolved.

I don't believe in the entitlement attitude held by individuals or major corporations who feel the majority of people in this country owe . The main point of the article is that these jerks go after and harrass people who have nothing to do with the debt, the friends and relatives of the debtors. They already have ways to contact the delinquents, but are using an unsuitable venue.

Well, I have to go back to WORK, so I'm afraid you'll have to go on without me.

Norm....How about this? How about the CEOs of HMOs stop paying themselves in the tens of millions and the HMOs stop using our insurance premiums for investments, most of which go sour?

No one expects "free" healthcare. But, $50 copays times a regular six week visit for high blood pressure. equals how much of lost pay in a year's time.(Gee I can't imagine why most Americans blood pressure is so high these days...the righties blame it on everything but the truth...stress).

I'm sick of people who love to pour salt in the wounds by refusing to take blame for their atrocious behavior. You are trying to let these egregious collectors off the hook. Bad behavior is bad. Admit it. Or are you one of those who is never wrong?

Mominsc: Sorry you are in the situation you find yourself in but glad you found another job and are dedicated to working yourself out of the situation. And you will. Good luck!

Event: The collectors aren't jerks to the people who lent the money. Let's agree to disagree on that point and move on. Oh, and if you can't afford the hip and knee a wheelchair is a perfectly good alternative. What are we popping new joints or hearts into 75+ year olds for anyway? Where is the return to society for the expense? If they want them they should pay for them, don't ask me. I'm a squirrel, I'll buy my own.

old wise man once said if you forget the lesson of the elderly you are doomed to repeat them.

In other words the elderly desreve just as much respect as squrrials do. They have more to offer

You are an idiot! To think you can possibly prepare for EVERY emergency - Oh I get it you must work for BP! Plenty of us have been struggling all our lives and have managed to dig out a little hole with a little house in decent neighborhoods. We aren't making as much as the Teachers, or Govt employees, and pay for all our own benefits. We dont drink or do drugs, use birth control and raise our own children. We dont expect anyone else to provide for us. We look 60 at 40 because we've been working and stressing all our lives but we have a little bit of happiness - Until our employer lays off 5 people and we no longer have a job. We muddle through for a while, no one will hire the middle aged, just trying to survive and not wind up homeless - so the rest of the collectors can go jump in a lake -We've pd our dues!

Yourday: Your last line says it all; you've paid your dues, just not your bills, and the people you owe can jump in a lake. Nice. Exactly everything our country isn't about. Where are you from, France? I'm glad you don't owe me any money, you'd never pay up! Must be nice to be entitled to a free ride.

Wolf: Those that pay their bills have self-respect. Courtesy and consideration is always warranted, but respect is earned, not granted.

One of the MORAL justifications for USURY is the risk the lender takes.

Norm - as I said befrore - you are an idiot - you are the prime example of the folls that will suck us hard working americans dry! No doubt you were born into money - got the free ride in college and got your management (no work) job because you know the right people! And no - I wouldnt owe you money unless you are a Hospital, because people like us dont have a lot of credit cards, and we dont borrow money - we try to live withing our means but the govt wont let us.

Your day: Maybe if you had a decent education and could have discourse without reverting to name calling and accusations you'd have a better job, less stress, and earn more money. It is said illiteracy and frustration go hand in hand; you sound quite frustrated in this thread.

The most amazing thing about your posts is you seem to know everything about me and I'm not even on Facebook!

I NEVER reverted to name calling or accusations - yes - I had to work to support myselt AND pay for my education and was only able to attend a 2 yr college. Anyone can use a thesaurus in an attempt to intimidate another with "his intelligence" but only the truly stupid ever resort to it.

One more...Hey Norm,

I've never ever had a bill collector have to call me except this once. Went to my Doctor for my annual physical checkup, paid my $10.00 copay, and was bill for two office visits on the same day. My insurance company it and notified me. I, in turn, notified my doctor's office only to be told that they don't billing, it's outsourced and I needed to contact them. I contacted them, told them about the double billing and even gave them my insurance company's 1.800 number to call. I was harassed by a POS bill collector 3 time a weeks. I sent a letter with the double billing proof and they still harassed me. Had to go to lawyer.

I then sent a bill for my time and the lawyer fee to my doctor office as an invoice. They failed to pay, so I contacted a bill collector. Now they receive the frilling calls.

No all of us are deabeats!

Again, we are talking about people who wanted things and agreed to pay for them, got them, but then won't pay.

I challenge you to try the same nonesense at your local gas station or cafe.

Who pays for you when you don't pay?

Everyone else!

Just because you wouldn't wait to save up the money before you bought something.

For that, I have to pay extra to carry you.

When Dave Ramsey says "Beans and Rice" that means you actually cook beans and rice ($.25 per serving when bought in bulk).

No cable tv, no cell phones. Used cars. Small houses or apartments.

Working second jobs.

I didn't get you into the mess you created for yourself - I was too busy giving up vacations, new cars, and a bigger house - so I wouldn't be a burden on others.

I know - you want to hear someone say it isn't your fault.

You want someone else to blame.

Maybe you blame a big company.

Did they stick a gun to your head and force you to buy things on credit?

I know all of you are too young to remember the Great Depression. If you had been through it, you would know better than to go into debt for "stuff" that you can live without.

Life is unpredictable, plan on there being some rainy days.

Julie - You went through all that for $10?

You could have just sent in $10.

I'll be honest, I don't believe a lawyer would take a case over a $10 billing question.

You could have gone to small claims court with your Doctor - who was the one that over charged you.

Although the judge would laugh about the $10.

Can't believe your Doctor wouldn't help you since it was the Doctor's fault.

Ryan,

Wish I lived in your perfect world. When I got out of the navy I had over 8 months worth of pay put aside. I moved back home, and found out living 9 in a house does not work. Had to rent. Then put down depoits on electric and water. Then add the cost of suits for the job interviews and the gas to travel to three or four a day and a part tiem job at walmart. no include the bills I had while I still in the military. That money for a rainy day does not last. Never have owned a new car but I bet the maintance on them would be lower in the short run. Can not fit a family of 5 in a two bedroom apartment, even though they will not rent to you. got a real job and still work part time at walmart.

If you live in perfect world please tell me how to get there, if not relaize that is your life is not the same as your neighors and unless you walk to work in their shoes do not blindly point the finger of Blame.

Oh by the way. military veterns returning from the war (national guard) are having a hard time paying their bills with the loss of an arm or hearing or eyesight and can not go back to their other job

Since these debts seem to be linked to car loans why dont the Finance companies just repo the vehicles?????? Could it be that these folks are right and these Debt collectors are just harassing them? If a car loan company is trying to reach you and cannot than I think they have a legal cause to repo the car but not to go to social sites and stalk you or harass folks who know you.

because she worked out a payment plan. They did reach her and they worked out a deal but they want their money faster.

Norm

they laugh at you for being such a stooge. You are in the box, my friend and you are providing your own security. "...you wouldn't have that problem." That "problem is manufactured for no other reason than to make money - the source of every woe we endure outside natural disaster and even then the natural disaster is exacerbated by money. Abandon the monetary system. It is obsolete as are its masters.

Wolften - You have 7 kids?

Many Americans are happy with 2 kids.

If you had 2, you could make your bills.

But let's be honest here - I didn't make them, so why should I pay for them?

Why do your decisions become my problem?

4 kids, a wife and my self. 2 live at home sisters and my mom. Guess you do not what a family of five is.

Oh yea a normal rich family is happy with a group of kids one or two that hand off to their nannies. Kids are a joy and if you had not quessed I had a kid for every cruise I did and guess what If I would have found a job when I got out I will still support the Lady. How does having 8 months of money not planning for the future? I did take personal reponiblity. and then all you say is why did your money run out.....

Have you ever been laid off?

I could pay for and do pay for them. I just struggled for 4 months. Go figure that I could not get a job I was qualified for because 500 people were appling.

When did your not caring nothing happens to me so I donot care attitude become my problems? never did answer my question about your perfect world but heck I did not expect much from a person that can not have one once of compassion for the millions of underemployed or unemployed. Guess there are jobs out there for all of us to make a living off from. Oh wait there is not enough jobs for all the unemployed

Ryan, Sorry about that. Guess I wasn't too clear.

Julie - You went through all that for $10?

You could have just sent in $10.

It wasn't the $10 copay but the charge for a second office visit for the same day. IIRC it was @ $ 160 for a second office visit. The insurance company wouldn't pay for the second office visit (which they shouldn't since I was there only once) so (per law) the second office visit becomes "the responsibility of the customer."

If it wasn't for the lawyer and my sister having worked for a bill collector, I would still be getting these calls.

Your Day Will Come -

What makes you think all Government employees make big bucks and get free health care? I really beg to differ with you on that. I am a government employee, I make a decent living and pay for my part of my premium for my HEALTH CARE! Nothing is handed to to me on a silver platter by the government. I go to work, do my job, 5 days a weeks for 40 hours a week. I am so sick and tired of people thinking as you do about Government Employees. I have been in both worlds, Private and Government and right now I am where I was 3 years ago before I was laid off in the private world. The only main difference, I paid all my credit cards off and closed them.

Wolften - So your 2 sisters and mom cannot work?

I'll bet you the nearest nursing home is hiring.

And we still have to bring in illegals to do the work that is "beneath" so many Americans.

Let me get this straight, you have no problem with someone picking your food - as long as it isn't you.

Julie - Your problem was with the Doctor.

There's no law that an incorrect bill submitted by the Doctor is your responsibility.

You should have gone after the Doctor in small claims court.

No lawyer needed.

Kedbob: get off the pipe. America is a capitalist country and even if you are correct that "money is the root of all evil" it is also the root of much of what is good. Without a profit motive little would be created and used by the spongers who don't pay their bills, the Henny Penn

My sister got harassed by a bill collector for money she didn't owe. She already paid it (on time) They started calling people with the same last name as her. They called my gramma who lived 500miles away, as well as other family members in that area. They called me at 6am and I live 3000 miles away and I dont have the same last name anymore. They called aunts, uncles, and cousins also.

They told every one of us that she owed like 1300$ (Which is illegal besides being false) Not once did they call her... She had 3 phone numbers with the company and they didnt call a single one of them. No email or bill in the mail either...

They didnt get this info from social networking sites (most of the people contacted didn't use the internet even, let alone social networking sites)

She ended up getting close to 2500$ settlement for all the harassment.

Norm - You seem like a respectful and reasonable guy, so I'm going to answer your earlier post with just as much respect, because you deserve an honest answer. You asked why should medical care be any different than food or other expenses. Why the big deal over medical expenses. Here's the honest answer:

People can easily control how much they spend on food, and to some degree, how much they eat. If you're having trouble making ends meet, you can go to a discount grocery store and pick out what's on sale, and carefully ration the food out to last until the next paycheck. Same with clothes and most other necessities. There is some degree of control over what you spend to get what you need.

Healthcare is completely different. You have almost zero control over your healthcare costs, even when you're being the most responsible person. Even if you eat right and take good care of yourself, stuff happens. When your kid falls off the jungle gym, has a seizure, or gets violently ill, you have to take her to the doctor or hospital. You have no control over what that might cost. As a parent, you do what you have to do to keep your child alive. To not seek medical help because you can't afford it would be negligent and cruel.

I have lived and learned with the high-deductible health insurance policies I've had over the years to be a smart consumer of health care and ask what a doctor visit or medical procedure costs before going through with it - when it's not an emergency. The system is not set up for people to be responsible consumers. Try calling around facilities in your area to find out what an MRI costs, or out-patient laparoscopic surgery. Even the nicest people on the other end of that call are baffled by the question of "how much" and the answer you're going to get is warped because there is no set amount. You have to get the "code" for the procedure and have them run it through your insurance, which no one wants to take the time to do. I have done this with both a surgery and an MRI - spent a week finding costs (one hospital refused to give out this information) what I was billed wasn't anywhere near the amount I was given on the phone.

You can walk into a grocery store, see a pound of hamburger and know what it costs. You can decide if you can afford it or not. If you can't, you buy a can of soup instead. You walk into a medical facility because you need help, and you have no idea what it's going to cost. It could be $50. It could be $50,000.

As an example, I recently went to a doctor for an injured foot. On top of the x-ray and office visit, he charged $357 to tape two toes together. I was prepared for the office visit. I didn't think to ask what that piece of tape was going to cost me.

So yes, everyone needs food, clothing and shelter, and all who are able to work should work and pay for those things. People should be responsible for their money. But healthcare costs are out of control, and out of reach for even people who are solidly in the middle class. People like me, who make a good living running my own business, are just one medical incident away from being wiped out. Even if I had $100,000 in savings, it would just take someone in my family getting cancer to wipe that out. And I'm insured. Only very wealthy people can have enough cushion not to be vulnerable to being wiped out by some medical issue. And that's not right. That's the difference.

It's very easy and cheap to file a lawsuit against debt collection agencies that violate the fair debt collection standards act.

On top of the x-ray and office visit, he charged $357 to tape two toes together

LOL, yeah that tape is expensive stuff.
==================

Medical costs in this country are outrageous, run by rich people and disigned to make themselves richer. Everyone needs medical care for one thing or another. I have no problem with universal healthcare.

My insurance company got billed for 627$ to look at my knee and give me a single pill (I think it was called ketarolac) I didnt use a gown, or my own room. Only a bed. They rolled a bed into the hallway and I sat on it. The dr came by, told me to roll up my pants (thankfully wasn't wearing jeans) he moved it around and made it hurt worse. Left a minute later. 45 minutes later they gave me a single pill as well as a Rx (which I had to pay for at a separate pharmacy)

Im really glad that I didn't have to pay that amount cuz I would not have been able to afford it.

____

I got charged 150$ for a dr to tell me I had athletes foot. It was actually poison sumac all over my body. In order for sumac to go away I need a shot. They wouldnt give it to me. Apparently the dr thought I had athletes foot (I stepped on the bush while wearing sandles), athletes leg, athletes stomach, athletes chin, athletes cheek, athletes ear, athletes finger, and probably a few other body parts... I had to go to another dr (and pay another fee) to finally get that shot.

____

I got stung by a bee and the swellling of my foot and leg wouldnt go down (I waited a week with NO improvement) almost 200$ later the dr says he wont give me anything (Im not a junkie I promise... I just like being able to walk around with my body parts not swollen and blistered)

3 weeks later I gathered up the money to go again and refused to leave until I got that shot. That visit cost 350$ (because of the shot)

Thats what the difference is with medical bills...

BTW, all these instances I had insurance... That was my bill on top of the insurance.

That's what Melanie Beacham of Tampa, Fla., said happened to her. Beacham fell behind in her car payments by $362. To collect the debt, MarkOne Financial called and called. They also sent e-mail and text messages.

Then, for some reason, MarkOne started using Beacham's Facebook account. They contacted friends and family members, asking them to have her call the company.

So....... let me get this straight. Bill collectors exhausted their communication options by multiple calls, emails and text/ messages without any response. I'm sure they didn't do that after being late few days. I hate bill collectors with a passion. One guarrantee way to get rid of them is to pay the bills and pay everything with cash. Live within your means.

If you post your facebook to the world, potential employers have access to your facebook....... I'm surprised this lady didn't expect bill collectors will do the same.

Its not even that they went on Facebook. They contacted her friends and family on there. I am hoping they didnt give details about her being in debt or how much because that is illegal.

Becca R, just for them to contact her family and friends is illegal if they inquired about her. The whole thing was illegal. But until there are criminal penalties, I don't think we'll see any improvement in debt collector behavior.

It's amazing how many people think facebook is sacred and private isn't it?

She could just use the privacy filters also they cant see your information.

Privacy filters ... lol!

All they have to do is submit a friend request, a massive percentage of people accept all friend requests because they like the 'status symbol' a high friend count gives them *rolls eyes*. Thus defeating every privacy filter...

massive percentage of people accept all friend requests

Then they are of a lower functioning brain capacity.

Well Capn-1, if someone friends someone they don't even know then they probably do deserve this.

I just don't see the point of having 500+ "friends" yet I see kids friending more and more people. Ridiculous!

I know each and every one of the friends I have and have known most of them for many years. I may not have a high friend count, but I can keep out a lot of the riff raff that way!

Eeesh!

Facebook can be safe if you are not a befriending freak and use the privacy filters. If money is due, then money is due.

Here's an idea... Don't buy crap you can't afford and don't use credit cards.

Live within your means. Obviously, this can't apply to the poor or jobless. I am speaking to people that have good jobs and also have millions in debt. It's ridiculous!

Does anyone really have 300+ real friends? I think it's pathetic and somewhat narcissistic. I don't even have time to get on facebook because I actually have a life. What is funny is that I see people at work (yes, at work) obsess over facebook and even take the dumbest pictures documenting everything they do when they are not on facebook, just to portray the mirage of a fantastic life to people they don't really know and aren't really friends with. I honestly don't get it. I'm sure these are just the type of people the debt collectors are catching up with.

Actually, it does apply to the jobless/poor. I fall under both, but live within my means. I cut up credit cards back in the early 90's. I'm cash and carry, and yes you will have to physically kill me to rob me, I'm just old school like that.

"What do you mean I don't pay my bills? Why do you think I'm broke, huh?"

Bighorn...Most people don't put personal information on Facebook. Those who do are foolish. However, with the sophistication of datamining these days, all you have to do is put in a vague location of your area and that's all they need. It's that refined.

No kidding. I sent a 'friend request' to an ex-gf who totally hates me, just to see what would happen. She accepted. I'm still sure she has no idea.

I know know precisely where she lives, how many kids she has, who she is married to, her daily events, job, etc.

Hullo people... knock knock... is anyone home!?!? Think McFly, think...

"Facebook can be safe if you are not a befriending freak and use the privacy filters. If money is due, then money is due."

Safe? If you consider everything you do somebody else's property, then yes it is safe. If you post a picture it is their property and you could be sued for selling or giving it somebody else.

@Michael Coats #2.8: "If there's a new way, I'll be the first in line."

A lot of the stupid games on facebook like Castle Age and Robin Hood require you to have X number of friends that are also playing the game and in your entourage in order to perform certain tasks and unlock certain prizes. This is where a lot of the friending people you don't know comes in. It's why I largely stopped playing those games. I don't like being forced to social network; particularly if I'm being forced to network with people I don't know. It's also why I don't play games like Command & Conquer 4, which try to force you to social network and do multiplayer.

I have some personal information on facebook, but I never friend anyone I don't know personally, and my privacy settings are maxed out, so not even friends of friends can see stuff on my facebook.

I did take my number off. Can't be too safe...

This is exactly what is wrong with America.

"I can't talk to you about the debts I owe you. I'm too busy playing on Facebook"

Ever think of selling the computer, cutting off the internet, and using that money to pay YOUR BILLS?

First off need the computer to do resumes, need the Internet to file said resumes. Oh wait there is library. Oh yea forgot their computers will not allow you to upload a file and most compinies laugh at paper resumes

It's amazing how everyone accepts the disfunction as a burden of the individual. It is amazing how we self-enforce our servitude. Why do people steal? Money. Whay do people cheat? Money. Why is there poverty? Money. Why is there so much environmental degradation? Money. Why are we consumers? Money. Why are goods shoddy? Money. Why does our government fail? Money. It's the system.

Wolften - Let me tell you places still accept paper resumes.

Especially when you come in to hand deliver them.

Vs. being anonymous over the Internet.

I wish you good luck in the Job search.

I would like nothing better than for every American to be fully employed.

But even during the Clinton years, only 1 in 3 Americans worked full time. That number hasn't changed.

Lets me list the places that do not or did not take paper resumes prior to me getting my real job

Grummun,boeing, walmart, target, sears, Orlando international airport, Disney wants a paper copy if you come in for an interview, same with Universal and Sea world. Southwest, Contrat air maintance compines, Kmart, Alberstosons, Win Dixie, Publix, any goverment job requires an online profile, the list goes on and on.

I got my two jobs. Both of them via an online resume. I tried handing my resume in at several places but was turned away. The only people intersted in it was the head hunters that found my my main job since, they put in application folder with a disk containing my online resume. When people exit the miltiary they tell online resumes is the way to go but make sure you have plenty of ppaper copies with the location of your online resume when at job fairs. trust me Last year was hell working 33 hours a week while spending another 48 hours Plus a week loojing for a real job

Wolften

You are persistent hard working and that is why you will succeed.Most people will not work the 48 hours a week looking for a job. By the way thanks for service (I think I remember you saying you were in Avionics field in the military). My wife is in the service and it is hard work and if you stand out you get loaded with more B.S.

Steve S - you are what the kids call a "creeper." Seriously.

A) You mock someone for blindly accepting your "friend" request, then brag about being a virtual peeping tom. I got the willies >:[

B) Your ex-gf "...has no idea." What? That she was your "girlfriend." Maybe if you had actually introduced yourself once, she would remember you.

Does anyone really have 300+ real friends? I think it's pathetic and somewhat narcissistic. I don't even have time to get on facebook because I actually have a life. What is funny is that I see people at work (yes, at work) obsess over facebook and even take the dumbest pictures documenting everything they do when they are not on facebook, just to portray the mirage of a fantastic life to people they don't really know and aren't really friends with. I honestly don't get it. I'm sure these are just the type of people the debt collectors are catching up with.

I have over 300 real friends. About 120 of my friend on facebook are family. Another 100 or so from the small town I lived in for 7 years. (I had some people from that era of my life add me and I reject because why werent much of friends growing up) Another 100 or so from the school that I transferred to when I was in high school. Everyone knew each other in that school and I was friends with just about everyone in my grade anId dozens of kids in other grades. Then there is the place I live now... I probably have about 30 or so people added from my husbands friends and friends I have made since I got married. Thats about 350 people. I am not on facebook all day and most of my posts are just funny random things that most of my friends seem to enjoy. I use filters to personalize posts for my friends from certain locations and my family. Every once in awhile I pick a bunch of people I havent talked to and send them a personal message. It really doesnt take that much time and makes it much easier to keep friendships over vast distances.

Auto,

Thank you. Truthfully I would rather be fixing aircraft instead being a team lead but you get what you are given. My presistent was driven by my need to provide for my family. There are more people out there like me that are having the same issue and do not want to take contracts overseas t get shot at for the same amount we were paid for in the military with less support.

I've been out of work two months and if someone offered me this job, I'd probably take it, given the choice of not being able to sleep at night and having a place to sleep at night. That's what the world is coming to.

Honestly, I'd probably crack under the sob stories I'd hear, but the prospect of an empty belly and sleeping in a doorway during a Pennsylvania winter can be powerful motivators. I don't think anyone enjoys doing this kind of work.

Finally, FYI, I dumped my facebook account, got tired of the empty superficial sympathy of ex co-workers.

they are karma

I know... a lot of people in debt act like they are not hurting anyone except the 'evil bank'.

But guess who pays for those losses? It's certainly not the bank.

Lost your job? Get a lower paying job to bridge the gap until you get another. Were you living paycheck to paycheck before you lost your job? Well, that was irresponsible and no ones fault but your own...

What ever happened to personal responsibility?

That is been extinctfor many years. Its not my fault my uncles brothers sister cousin former roommate did it.

To answer the question of whether debt collectors have gone too far, yes. They are out of control. Most call themselves "collection lawyers". Since you can't ask them to prove they are licensed lawyers, that's fraud.

They go too far when they send pretend "court officers" to your job with IDs that are faked and look all too real.

There are many people who are in debt in the US due to unemployment and foreclosure. Do debt collectors have the right to harass people living through hard times?

It's my understanding that an outstanding debt is sold for pennies on the dollar to these debt collectors who then can take a $300 debt and turn that into $3000. How is that not extortion?

i think people are failing to understand that a bank lent this woman money to purchase a car, with the agreement she would pay. a car, which she was probably still driving around, essentially for free since she stopped paying. whether or not it was due to financial hardship, or financial irresponsibility isn't relevant. she was clearly ignoring the calls, because she didn't have the money to pay. unfortunate things happen, but doesn't the company have a right to try to get their money? i don't think they should be able to harrass you or say anything illegal or offensive, but the fact is she was the one in the wrong, in the first place.

if you lent someone money or were self employed and performed a service for someone and they stopped paying you, and began ignoring your calls, you would probably try to track them down too, i'd guess

@Capn1 So it's the poors fault for working for some greedy prick who is too cheap to pay someone what he is making? Is it the poors fault they work 50 or 60 hours to go home to their nice public housing and eat a meal paid with food stamps becuase some lame ass needs his 31 cents dividend on stocks that used to go to the workers as bonuses?

Maybe we just need to kick these types of CEO's and companies back to China, and leave real jobs for real Americans here. I have no problems with that thinking. Workers are being crapped on, and it is by corporations that must answer to stockholders, where's my profit?

Michael Coats....The "Haves" love to look down those snobby noses stuffed up by years of excess and luxuries because they suffer from "affluenza". To them, there's no excuse ever to be bankrupt, not even when your Ahole employer hasn't given you a salary increase in half a decade, your wife or child is seriously ill or your recovering from a fire or other disaster.

I absolutely detest today's young Know it Alls. They have answers for everything because they haven't lived long enough to know what hardship is. They have always had McMommy and McDaddy pay for everything up and until they married in their middle age. But they are the first ones to bitch about how much it costs to send their own kids to school. This when they aren't demonizing their parents who earned the right to what they have.

And why did those big banks need a bailout? They were forced by the Community Reinvestment Act (CRA), a fine example of government good intentions with unintended consequences, to lend money to people they knew would not be able to pay them back.

No one has a gun put to their head to spend more money than they make. As a number of folks have already stated, personal reponsibility is what is really needed.

sjacobs...Oh puhlease....Those "big" banks were playing games. Try to deny that Goldman Sachs didn't know those loans would fail so they could collect billions in downpayments and deposts and then force foreclosures that added a second line of profit.

You like to make individual personally responsible but not banks? No one put a gun to Llyod Blankfein's head to accept a bailout and then take a huge increase in his salary either.

Blaming the little guy when the big guns make those chief decisions is an excuse.

sjacobs? Who told you that? Rush? Glenn? Thanks for the laugh. The big banks needed bailouts because they were playing unethical and in some cases illegal games with other people's money because of pure greed, and they lost. Get a clue.

Michael- That's the problem. Many of the people who lost their jobs was because those companies moved overseas. Why do you want to kill more American jobs by tossing the wealthy business owners to China (who would welcome them with open arms). Those wealthy business owners got that way primarily through hard work and tremendous risk of their own money. They had no promise of success, the the promise of opportunity. Just because you failed to capitalize on that don't blame them.

Why would anyone pay a low level employee who barely graduated from high school what the boss makes? Don't you think that person should work their way towards that level of pay? I would think that most folks living on the public dime are doing so because of their own behavior or decisions. I bet if you stopped the welfare check they would find a job.

Todd...Not exactly accurate. Remember the 10,000 at Bear Stearns who lost jobs in a single day in 2005 or was it 2004? Who was at fault for those job losses? It comes out in the dirty laundry that Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley were behind it all with the intention of knocking out of their path of competition one of the US's oldest and most trusted investment firms.

It was all downhill from there.

The debt collectors are helping society rid itself of scumbag deadbeats who leech off other people. These losers enrich themselves with money that isn't theirs, just as surely as if they'd taken it at gunpoint. They deserve to be harassed. Most of them ought to be in jail. Who would hire a worthless deadbeat? People who won't take care of their own affairs, certainly can't be trusted to take care of their employer's affairs.

Jacques-2757417 Post # 3 Thank you for your post that comes in the holy month of April. No, I do not mean tax time, I mean the time of Easter and Passover.

I am only a little surprised that your post was so mildly attacked. Had it been first person singular; you, rather than some one who had your telephone number in the past; the self righteous among us would have jumped all over your comments.

What is the Bible story about "The Day Christ Lost His Cool?" Yes sir, it has to do with money lenders.

I have been around long enough to recall the years before "credit cards," aka "high interest loans." We had, back then, "in-house-accounts." Perhaps you have seen it in the movies; "put it on my tab, or my account." My grocer, or tailor would do just that and then send a bill at the end of every month. If one properly uses a credit card, and pays every month the total amount due, they have just had the use of free money for thirty days.

I am getting to my point and yours. It would take more than a single volume book to fully examine this topic.

Have we as a people; a nation, lost so much much of our self respect that people now assume that they do not have to pay back money borrowed, or pay for services rendered? Jefferson said; " Pride costs us more than hunger, thirst, and cold."

I know that books have been written on the topic; "Taking A Free Ride In America." Is this course on the methodology offered in classes in our public schools and universities? We now have compounded generations of Americans who live this way. They do not have to absorb any bills and consequently do not receive telephone calls from "The Bill Collector."

I too have wondered about several different jobs that people choose in order to make their living. The "Bill Collector" is one of them.

When all is said and done. When death is knocking on the door. When the bill collector is prone on his bed, as family members surround him waiting for the last intake of air, and the last profound words of wisdom; what is he saying or thinking? How can it be possible for him to gasp; " through my years of hard work, I leave this world a far better place than the one I was born in to?"

Ewent, I will take this opportunity to provide you with a little education, of which you are sorely in need. I will try to do this in the simplest terms I can.

1) CRA was implemented in the 1970s to prevent banks from 'redlining', a practice of not lending money to people in certain zip codes because they were low income, minority, etc. The rule requires banks to produce a certain % of their loans in these areas. Failure to do so can cause a penalty from the Fed that limits the number of loans a bank can make. Testing is done on an annual basis and banks must prove compliance every year.

2) Any bank will tell you they are not in the real estate business, they are in the lending business. Foreclosures are expensive. Each non-performing loan is a direct reduction in the amount of a bank's lending capacity. In other words, a $100k non-performing loan ties up of $100k of lendable assets. Banks do not make money owning real estate.

3) "loans would fail so they could collect billions in downpayments and deposts and then force foreclosures that added a second line of profit." This comment doesn't make sense because it's not true. First, because banks don't want to own real estate. Second most of these loans had less than 3% downpayment. With the housing downturn, this equity vanished. banks are sitting on assets they paid more for (the origial loan amount) than they are worth (current market value).

4) There is plenty of blame to go around to banks, consumers and the government. No one's hands are clean.

The banks did not force people into homes they could not afford. The government did force banks to lend money to people they both knew could not and would not repay. Banks did get what they deserved for creating low/no document loans and lending money to people based on what they claimed their income to be.

sjacobs...Didn't your Mama ever tell you that trying to educate another adult is an insult to their intelligence? All your post proves is that whenever a business can, it will look for loopholes.

Your post is so full of BS. All you have to do is follow the track of the loans which HUD and other experts in the financial areas have already stated: Goldman and Morgan both are responsible for the huge amount of money they took in profits from those foreclosures.

You are the one who needs an education. Yeesh...every red-blooded autocrat with a need to prove how wonderful American banks are is out in full force. American banks are too large. Too big to fail? They did in 2008.

Now...education for you...For every piece of legislation that government has tried to give structure and regulation to those beady eyed greedheaded bankers and mortgagers, these swillers at the trough manage to find a loophole. You are in denial big time. Too bad that denial no longer works when its we, the people, who are bailing, they, the greedheads.

My apologies for confusing you with facts.

When a land developer eyes every bit of open space in the northeast like it was prime rib, develops it with 3500 square foot homes he's selling for $500,000 apiece, don't tell me that if these are the only homes available for a family of four, that's affordable and that the land developer isn't just a pig who doesn't give a fat rat's patoot what he's leaving behind when those homes need tons of municipal resources the people who lived in a town 40 years won't end up paying higher taxes for.

My advice to young people, less is more. Don't make a land developer richer than God. Buy a smaller home, older home. You can always renovate and add on.

That developer can't develop anything without a permit. That permit is supplied by the local government. They are responsible for land/resource use projections.

sjacobs...In NJ, land ownership gives them the right to develop their properties. Although, you are correct, they must seek municipal planning and zoning approval that determines the status of the type of development allowable for their particular land parcel. Which in the Soprano State usually means wink wink nod nod and you get to do whatever you want.

I am thankful every day I do not live in the Northeast.

@Capn1 So it's the poors fault for working for some greedy prick who is too cheap to pay someone what he is making? Is it the poors fault they work 50 or 60 hours to go home to their nice public housing and eat a meal paid with food stamps becuase some lame ass needs his 31 cents dividend on stocks that used to go to the workers as bonuses?

I have no idea what I said that got you onto a rant about poor people. If someone chooses that lifestyle, they yes I expect them to live within the means they have chosen. That means no cell phone, no internet, no cable TV, no brand new truck, no alcohol, and especially no drugs (yes even everyone's favorite).

This is where you say they don't choose to live like that right? That it's the rich man's fault. BS. Where there is a will, there is a way. There are plenty of ways for the poor to get free or near free education, education that puts them on the same level as anyone else coming out of college. You don't have to be rich to learn how to be an engineer, or run a business for yourself, become a teacher, or become a scientist. Money does not equal intelligence. The first step to getting out of the gutter is to stop blaming other people and aggressively pursue your options. If it was easy, everyone would do it. How do I know? I've been there. No one paid for my college, I didn't inherit anything, I worked throughout High School and College to pay my own way.

There are plenty of people that live just like you said, no phones at all, no internet, no tvs, no cars at all, no school , no drugs either type, and no food, no power, no water, not roof over their head. Thse families are as of late the same one that manged small business, ran Walmart departments, fixed cars, rockets and airplanes, fought in wars for the goverment.

I know of way to many collage grads that still work at Walmart or disney since that is the only jobs they can find since most need 5 years experince in that field.

By the way Republicans aare cutting most programs to help the middle class and below send kids to collage so unless thay get a scholarship from the collage it is not going to happen

i think people are failing to understand that a bank lent this woman money to purchase a car, with the agreement she would pay. a car, which she was probably still driving around, essentially for free since she stopped paying. whether or not it was due to financial hardship, or financial irresponsibility isn't relevant. she was clearly ignoring the calls, because she didn't have the money to pay. unfortunate things happen, but doesn't the company have a right to try to get their money? i don't think they should be able to harrass you or say anything illegal or offensive, but the fact is she was the one in the wrong, in the first place.

I think starting a sentence w/ capital letters hasn't yet gone out of style. I also think reading comprehension could do w/ a refresher course. This article did not state that this woman had "stopped" making her car pymts, just that she'd fallen behind to the tune of $362.

That's probably ONE car pymt. Doesn't sound like all of them to me & if it is, I want to know where she got a car for $362 & if it runs good b/c I want one, too. In the meantime, the bank's raking in additional interest & late fees on this single missed pymt, so clearly they're not losing any money.

B/c the article also said she had reached a pymt agreement w/ them b4 they began harassing her on Facebook. So it's not like she was "ignoring" the poor bank. She was already paying them.

Since it said "agreement" I would guess in increments satisfactory to both sides. So no reason to continue to bug her about it when she was paying on the debt as agreed by them, is there?

Your basic miscommunication screwup, which happens a lot more often than you'd think where banks & loans are concerned. Once the bank LOST the check for my car pymt & didn't bother to tell me. What they did was take February's pymt as January's to make up for the one they lost & therefore deliberately put me a month in arrears. Of course I wasn't notified of any of this until I received a computer-generated pymt demand in April blathering on about how "patient" the bank had been waiting for me to make my January pymt! And yes, I did noticed the $ was still in my checking acct, but they had no set pattern of withdrawal & often took wks after pymt was remitted to snag it, so I couldn't set my watch by it.

Yeah, you best believe I had some Lord High Mucky-Muck's nuts in a vise for this "ooops" on the bank's part, as I was not paying late fees & extra interest or so much as the stop pymt fee on my original check to my bank, let alone have this false info on my credit report, when the branch loan officer admitted she had my check in her hand, sent it for "processing", & it "disappeared".

So sometimes it's not even ppl's fault when banks screw up on loans. B/c the banks don't want to admit their incomptence right off the bat, it can take mos to straighten out.

And yknow, I wonder if most of you were born w/ silver spoons in your didies & suck off a trust fund sugar tit to this day that you can't entertain the simple fact that "@!$%# happens" (illness, injury, job loss), it can happen to anyone, & it's not just a matter of "personal responsibility". If for whatever reason the $ isn't there, then it isn't there, & scribbling on ppl's Facebook walls while gleefully chortling about public humiliation isn't going to make it magically appear.

As the story said, in this particular case, the debt collector had no reason to be on this woman's FB at all as she was paying the debt. But I guess some of you were too busy pontificating on how well-off financially you are to actually read & understand the article b4 commenting?

Michael Coats

Wheres your profit? Why do you think you should get part of the profit, did you take part of the risk? You get a paycheck for doing a job, nothing more, nothing less. You would be glad to take part of the profit, but what if your boss came to you and said "we had a bad month and sorry, and you dont get a paycheck this month", how would that fly with you?

@Capn-1: The problem with your theory is that the banks have bought revisions to laws that in effect re-introduce usury (which used to be a CRIME, interest rates over 15%: do this, and you used to GO TO JAIL). These days, banks charge 38.4%.

The banks claim some strange civil rights moral advantage in doing this: they claim that cheap credit increases the standard of living for more people. But in reality, it avoids the checks and balances of proper background checks, checks required for repayment.

Thirty years ago, could you imagine a bank going bankrupt offering 10% loans? These days, they go bankrupt charging 38.4% (for loans, plus other rickety instruments, like balloon mortgages). So much of the infrastructure is based on the presumption of instability (remember, no proper vetting) and easy money that it's truly a house of cards, and WILL come crashing down again.

Next time, let it die. Maybe the successor companies will have a clue. The current crop are staffed with opportunistic, greedy, evil people.

I'm sure those wealthy businessmen are just itching to move their companies over to China where in most cases they will have to sell 50% to a Chinese business before they will be allowed to operate. This mess has happened in part because university business schools started teaching that profit and investment return is all that matters. Employees are just tools like the rest of the machines in the plant. Discarded when no longer needed and at the bottom of the list for maintenance/benefits.

Ed posted -

What ever happened to personal responsibility?

Don't take out a loan if you can't afford to pay it back.. make a budget, set money aside for unexpected expenses, none of this involves particularly difficult math.

I'm getting tired of all the colapsed comments. Please join me in reposting all the non-offensive ones.

If you don't like the rates they are loaning at, don't borrow from them.

But you are probably facing 38% interest BECAUSE you haven't paid back all your prior loans.

Look at credit cards for example. Their biggest cost is people who don't pay their debts.

We all have to pay so some can play.

Your rates would be less than half of what they are now if

1. The Gov't forced deadbeats to pay their debts (like they do with child support).

2. The Gov't went after Fraud/Theft on Credit Cards the same way they go after Fraud on taxes.

You good people are so mired in the control system that you can't realize that you keep yourself in it. Individual responsibility is a myth. You can't be responsible for what you do not control and you don't control anything except your own ilk while you are being controlled. End Money.

Venus Project. The end of money. The end of scarcity.

seems like a form of legalized harassment, why didnt the company, instead of repeatedly calling her, just go and repo her car? I had a collection company call me looking for someone, who either had my number before or just gave out my home number as theirs, either way, the relentless calls, finally drove me over the edge, I tried to explain to 2 different collection agencies that they had the wrong number, to no avail, I finally started documenting the calls and recording them, and threatened these tyrants with legal action, thankfully that was enough...

they could not repo her car since she worked out a payment plan

policy to contact individuals and their friends and family using Facebook "as a means to harass consumers and their families."

Beecham hired Howard, who sued MarkOne, claiming violations of both federal and Florida law. The complaint states that MarkOne has a corporate

Apparently she doesn't have the money to pay the bills but have the money to pay the lawyer to sue...... Isn't America great?

Stop The Hypocrisy...May the gods of misfortune, unemployment and foreclosure strike you for your judgementalism of others. Good fortune doesn't last a lifetime...better enjoy all it while you can. Gravy train for thieves is in the roundhouse and ready to be dismantled.

Ewent,

Chance favors the prepared mind and you can make your own luck. Why not prepare for bad times during the good by paying down debt and building cash reserves? Personal responsibility

While it is true she owed the company, I think she's quite aware of that fact. Getting on facebook and attempting to embarras her and bugging all of her friends, thereby making themselves a nuissance is what the problem is. Personnally I think the companies harrassment should end at mail and phone call. Digital activities should be considered illegal and punishable by law. At the most they should be able to ping your email, but only once a week and it should never be made public. We don't allow them to go to the center of town and scream this out, we shouldn't allow it online.

sjacobs...So...you're saying that the $17 billion Madoff bilked from his investors means they should have prepared for his bilking them? How personally responsble was Madoff, Ebbers, Ken Lay and Jeff Skilling, Kozlowski or Milken?

Your way and every word out of anyone's mouth is suspect. Your way and no contract in writing can be trusted. Isn't that exactly what the schiesters in this country fear most?

@ewent: Been there done that (unemployed, foreclosed upon/homeless, so broke I couldn't pay attention, etc). But I never tried to parlay my personal misfortune(s) into a "Get Out Of Debt Free" card or play the victim card because my creditors wanted me to fulfill my end of a contract or debt. In other words, unlike deadbeat Melanie Beacham of Tampa, FL, I didn't run crying to the news media when I couldn't pay my debts - I just paid them as soon as I could. And if a few phone calls and a dinged-up credit report were the worst things I suffered, I got off lucky.

Stop The Hypocrisy...I realize there are people in this country so accustomed to being "taken care of". However, I also know many people who don't ask for the debt they are in. For some seniors on fixed incomes all it takes is one serious hospital trip. For others, it's job loss.

I was a single Mom who refused to flirt with the idea of welfare. I paid off my mortgage on a secretary's salary. I know hardship growing up on a small farm. But, I also know that to give up hope is deadly. To become too complacent and adopt a sense of financial safety is a fantasy. My Great Depression parents taught me that hard times don't last but you have to make the best with what you have and live within your means.

Unfortunately, today's younger people like to live large and then look over their shoulders at the older people who paid their dues. Spoiled brats until they are 50.

Most of the problems in this country are directly related to allowing corporations too much control and to grow too large as to be a threat to the government itself.

Ewent

Madoff is a great example. He ran his fund for over 20 years. Very few complained about the 20% returns promised and delivered up until it all went south.

FYI - More folks turned down investing in Madoff's scheme than actually invested in it because of the lack of transparency, notably New York's Guggemheim Museum.

sjacobs...And those who did like NJ's Loretta Weinberg, a former governor's right hand lady lost her retirement to Madoff? The former governor of NJ saw to it that taxpayers compensated her for her losses. Why? She made those decisions to invest with Madoff. Why do we have to help her out of debt when she is already collecting a NJ government pension? Not enough for Mrs. Got Rocks to live on?

I happen to know that a lot of public pensions were also in that Madoff scheme. What galls me is his chutzpah that he actually has the arrogance to think everything is just fine and dandy. So much so that last reports have it that he's now "teaching finance" in prison. Just what we need, a dozen more Madoffs to bankrupt others.

We may have found common ground.

Those who bet on Madoff and lost got what they asked for. If the AGs want to confiscate his family fortune to compensate those swindled, I have no problem with that. The taxpayers should not bail any of his investors out. Insofar as public pensions are concerned, they should have known better.

I believe you are referring to Mr. Corzine, former Goldman CEO, as the former NJ govenor who gave Ms. Weinberg her money. Interestingly Mr. Corzine is a staunch Obama supporter. So much for the idea that crony capitalism is a Republican thing.

sjacobs..I am so glad you chose to use that word "bet" with regard to investing. I'm not a prude where gambling in a Casino is concerned while on vacation or for fun. I am, however, hugely concerned with the world's biggest gambling casino...Wall Street. We can both agree that lightening quick ROI in today's Wall Street environment is frought with abuses and scams. It reminds of that old saw, "The hand is quicker than the eye." Only in reverse thanks to Wall Street's computers. Before a computer screen can change, it's possible to pull off massive fraud on Wall Street.

You do catch subtleties. Investing is doing research, finding quality opportunities and investing for the long haul via a buy and hold or dollar cost averaging.

sjacobs...It's the fast cash, lightening fast ROI investors that are destroying the market. I agree that investing has to be for the long-term. How can anyone invest money into paper corporations that are so flim-flam they'll collapse in the first wind.

I use to laugh when my old aunt kept buying stock in AT&T back in her 20's (for her that would have been the early 1930's or so). But she always said you invest in what you most believe in. Her entire retirement income was comprised of her residuals from her stock in what used to be Standard Oil, AT&T which I believe she called "Western Union" and her famous US bonds she so prized.

If you didn't walk on that dark street, that would not have happened.

If you didn't dress that way, that wouldn't happen.

Yeah, its the same thing. The set up, the trap and the exploitation. People just doing their job in the wrong army to the detriment of all save the insulated and even them in the end. Fascism is the natural outgrowth of free enterprise and markets. Your value is intrinsic and it is false to measure your value by money.

"I make a ton. I do harm. I hate my job. But I have more money than you and I keep perpetuating this even though I am a decent person who can't realize I have been corrupted my whole life."

I doubt they signed up as a business page or on behalf of their firm. Other recent articles on the subject detail debt collectors' employees signing up for facebook with pseudonyms.

Why should a business not use any means available to collect money a customer owes them? The business acted in good faith providing a product/service. The customer is not by refusing to pay their bills. What gives the deadbeats the right to free-load on the rest of us?

sjacobs...Not all businesses in the US remotely know what "good faith" means. I'm not supporting anyone who deliberately refuses to pay for the things they buy. That's theft in my mind. In today's business mentality, it's who you can scam and that's also theft.

Ewent

Fair enough. Not all busiensses practice ethical behavior.

The vast majority of these collectors are not collecting debt owed to their companies. They are in fact gambling like other investors. They have bought debt from other companies, most frequently after the company has decided it is "un-collectable", for pennies on the dollar in a bet that they will collect something. In many cases these "debts" are years old and way outside of the window of when the debtor can be sued to collect the debt. Their gamble is that if they harass the person long enough and hard enough they will simply pay something. Our fair collection laws are designed to prevent these collectors from using public humiliation as a tool because frankly lots of mistakes in identity are made and the wrong person gets accused of owing the debt. Not allowing these collectors to post their claims on Facebook or any other social networking site is completely reasonable.

Sja....

the point is that the institutions DO NOT act in good faith, ever. That is all institutions today.

What does Wall Street do except rake off value? They produce nothing. They influence the negative to occur. They cheat. Why? Money. And they bought most of us. We're boxed in. They put us in the box. The end of money is near. It doesn't work. It isn't sustainable. Venus Project. Try some.

That doesn't always work. All a repo does is recover the vehicle, which is usually just put up for auction, then it is sold for usually much less than what is owed on the actual loan. The borrower on the loan agreement is still liable for the difference between what is recovered by the sale and what is owed on the loan. The car is just an artifact, the objective is first to recover the money owed. The creditors ultimately want their money, not the car. A repo (or just dropping off the car at the dealer) won't always end the liability. It'll further damage credit ratings too. Best bet is to try to sell the car privately for what is owed on it and pay off the loan--if possible.

debt is a Bi.. isn't it?

Auto....did you ACTUALLY read the whole story. She had already called the finance folks and set up to pay what she owed. It was after that they went after her on facebook. She called the lawyer AFTER the facebook harassment.

Auto101...Actually, for corporations, debt means paying less in taxes. You can get away with paying taxes for a specific number of years if you claim bankruptcy or a loss of revenue.

Depends on who owns the debt. If individuals got off with managing debt the way corporations and the wealthy do, these debt collectors would disappear.

Most wealthy people are not to their eye balls in debt. She took the risk in getting a loan. I don't really care that she set uppayment plan she is still behind. In most states you can repo if your 10 days late.

10 days after the owner has been contacted and no payment plan has been reached

Auto101...Most wealthy people don't get that way without scamming someone, somewhere down the line. How many times did Trump file for bankruptcy? 3 to my knowledge. He made a very profitable windfall for himself with each one. Got him off paying all by a certain percentage of the debts he owed, didn't it?

I know this because one company I worked for had 2 clients that filed for Chapter 9 and 11. We saw about $100 of the $2500 they owed us. Meanwhile, they got back on their feet and changed their business status to LLC to protect themselves if ever their business nose dived.

Businesses and corporations have huge government protections individuals in debt don't. That's unfair. The only reason for this is that the government perceives business debt as more consequential to the economy. Yet, the government also does back peddles the economy by dumping business taxes and debts from bankruptcies onto individual who have less of those protections. How stupid is that?

So why don't you quit trolling for those slimy debt collectors, Auto-101?

Wow this Auto guy is a real jerk he is obviously nothing but a paid minions of the nefarious debt collection business. Don’t bother anymore ewent; Stop the Hypocrisy, sjacobs123, and Auto 101 are asshats they don’t deserve any kind of consideration, and like you mention before... may the Gods of Foreclosure, Repossessions, illness, and bankruptcy pay them a visit real soon.

EVIL BASTARTDS!!!!

Actually I work as An Auto Technician and I'm good at it I pay my bills. I have the self respect to pay my bills or I resolve it. I wont go into debt any more ever again I will buy my house in cash when I do.

Did everyone miss the part of the article that states she had made payment arrangements with the company BEFORE they got on Facebook? Am I the only one that read that part or are you all just out to make this something more than it is and continue to call someone you don't know a deadbeat based on half of the information that supports your conclusion?

Auto101...Not to discredit Auto technicians...I have only one I know I can trust. How you'd like to take your flat tire to an auto repair shop and have them charge you $20 to put "air" in the tire"? Oh sure, dumb women can't tell the difference in whether air's in there or the tire was fixed until they drive it a few miles and it goes flat all over again. Those "No Customers Allowed in Repair Area" insure that you can't see what's going on.

Oh sure, dumb women can't tell the difference in whether air's in there or the tire was fixed until they drive it a few miles and it goes flat all over again. Those "No Customers Allowed in Repair Area" insure that you can't see what's going on.

Maybe those "dumb women" should become "smart women" then? If you want to have the privelege of driving, maybe you should educate yourself on the 2.5 ton missile you're guiding down the road. "Personal responsibility." When you release your car to a mechanic, make it clear that unwarranted or unauthorized repairs are not ok. This can be as simple as saying "if you find anything else, please call me to discuss before proceeding with the work." "Personal responsibility," again.

Do you find it odd that this phrase keeps occurring?

Having customers in the repair area is a severe safety issue for both the customer and the employees of the shop. This has nothing to do with masking the operation.

Ed...I work with engineers....mechanical, chemical and environmental. I am fortunate to have had their guidance around scam artists in the car repair industry. But there is no way you could tell if air was put in a flat tire or if it was repaired.

I love how you go for the jugular for all the wrong people. Your post defends a guy who didn't do what he was paid to do?

Is there some reason that jackass auto technician had to collect $20 fraudently? He deliberately turned the tire so I couldn't possibly see he hadn't removed the nail on the inside of the tire unless I crawled underneath which Mr. Scam Artist wasn't about to allow given all of those "safety" signs for customers to keep clear of his work area.

Now...for you....It's time all of the slick artist slime balls start taking personal responsibility and stop bilking the rest of us with their slime ball rip offs.

I'm sorry to say this example is poor. What if you had two nails in your tire and he only saw one? what if the plug or patch he did was just a poor job and failed? What if he simply fallowed what the RO stated add air and your writer was a crook? The what if games goes for ever here in my world. I have seen tires have three nails in it nun leak but the person that installed the tire didn't clean the wheel and the bead is leaking. I have replaced Timing belts and 500 Miles later the power steering rack fails causing the CAN line to shut the car off and it is my fault.

Now...for you....It's time all of the slick artist slime balls start taking personal responsibility and stop bilking the rest of us with their slime ball rip offs.

My understanding of the situation was that the car was brought in for a repair, and the mechanic took an opportunity to charge for other services rendered that were not requested. Whether these services were fraudulent or legitimate, I believe this was not the right thing to do.

With your recent post I have a better understanding that the mechanic charged for work that was not completed. I agree that this is terrible.

Getting back to my other post, my position is simply that there are things that every day, regular people can do to avoid being scammed.

Ed...I work with engineers....mechanical, chemical and environmental. I am fortunate to have had their guidance around scam artists in the car repair industry.

That is laughable I have had to smack more than one of them down to show they had know knowledge about cars. I had one that said a MAF could not cause a traction, ABS, And the engine light to come on. He wanted me to replace the ABS unit. I had to tell him "NO you can take your car to another dealer I will not replace something that I have no evidence that it is the cause".

Auto101...One of the guys is a real car nut. He bought a new engine (probably not explaining this right) and an Avanti (not sure of the spelling) body??? and when it was done, it looked like a weird kind of sports car.

If you tell I said this about engineers, I'll hotly deny it. Engineers know to the centimeter how wide a run in your pantyhose is and then walk outside the office door and fall into a 15 ft. diameter hole in the sidewalk...roflmao.

Having customers in the repair area is a severe safety issue for both the customer and the employees of the shop. This has nothing to do with masking the operation.

When my car's up on the rack or has its hood up in a bay, my mechanic will beckon me on over to show me exactly what's wrong, show me a part that needs replacement, tell me what he's going to do, & give me the final price (not a quote) b4 he does it. A reputable place will go that extra mile for their customers b/c they want that repeat business & they want you to feel comfortable bringing your car back to them knowing they're not going to rip you off. Any mechanic who says "no" when a customer asks "can I see that myself?" isn't doing himself any favors. The best mechanic I ever had, sadly now retired, was a woman.

Yeah, yeah, "Auto" I'm sure you did. Your attitude sounds like one I ran into where the dealer swapped the alternator TWICE for what was obviously a voltage regulator problem. Turns out the regulator wasn't even IN the alternator, it was on the fire wall. Had one of you ilk practially yell at me when I asked about it. Went to the parts department, asked for a regulator and took it back to the guy to show him what it looked like. Yeah, you all are MUCH smarter than engineers... NOT!

And as for not caring the lady had been working with the company to catch up. Typical. It's ALWAYS the customers fault with your type.

And your example of two nails in one tire.. HA!! Same deal, just SOOOO sure of yourself you won't test the fix. It should be obvious that if there's one nail the possibility of another exists but you just do the easy thing and let the customer do the diagnosis for you. Lazy, self centered and D-U-M dumb.

but you just do . Lazy, self centered and D-U-M dumb.

Throw what insults you want I don't really care I have know Idea who you are But I Know my worth. Last two years I have fixed and worked on about 2,000 cars a year with 1-2 comebacks. I have been requested to go to other dealers to diagnose cars I have been called by my former employer that is 800 miles away asking if I can divorce my wife and comeback. Dumb, Lazy, self centered yes have fun with your small useless words I have a worth and I use it everyday.

It's ALWAYS the customers fault with your type.

Sometimes it is sometimes it is not. If there is no proof of outside influence then it is a defect. For the most part the biggest liars are the customers.

see Auto, you do not like it when people make blanket statements about you and your business.

You folks crack me up. "Personal Responsibility" is simply the right's sugar coating on what the left calls "Greed". Auto with your attitude you will never have to worry about those house payments. You wont last long in any business blaming the customer for all of the ills. But that is the nature of your brand of "personal responsibility" isn't it. Guys like you and Ed need to get a little hair on you and you'll figure it all out. It will take awhile before you guys figure out your generation doesn't know it all.

You wont last long in any business. figure out your generation doesn't know it all.

LOL You are the greatest have a nice day.

Auto, you do not like it when people make blanket statements about you and your business.

It use to bother me until I realised that most of these people don't even know what a ratchet is and think a screw driver is just a drink :<)

but then why do make blanket statements about other groups. any by the way which screwdriver a number 1 or 3 and what tip hex, phillips, straight or star. And what kind of ratchets? Of course the ones you use are much nicer than the ones the navy bought for us.

,If they're stupid it,s ok to screw them' right, (read sarcasm)

Don't be mooks. Realize that the rules you have mastered (auto 101) are false and do not serve us. Stop valuing yourself through money. That is the trap. That thinking supports abuse and continues injustice. It is the monetary system. Poof! Money out of thin air. What are the consequences? You are seeing them. Too big to fail? No. They own the government (fascists) they deserve to fail and will, ultimately.

Who should have bread?

if you set up your face book to be that Anonymous then what do you expect. Let people know who you are. It is a SOCIAL network. if you have to stay that hidden on it to be confused with someone else then stop using it

Kayless....Amen to that. One debt collector mistook me for a woman with the same name as mine and oddly enough her husband's first name was the same as my then husband's.

The debt collector came to our house and insisted to my ex that I was that woman. Next thing you know they call the cops to arrest me. Guess what? The other "me" was half a foot taller and unlike me had red hair. Or so we were told by the cops at the door.

Kayless...that is a serious problem, indeed.
These scumbag debt collectors DO make mistakes but will not acknowledge their mistake. I went to the hospital. A couple of months before I went to the hospital I had changed insurance companies. When I got out of the hospital I kept getting a bill that should have gone to the new insurance company but the hospital records only showed that I had canceled the original company's policy. I presumed, incorrectly, that the hospital would realize their mistake and find and confer with the new insurance company. They did not and turned it over to a debt collector that harassed me a dozen times a day by phone. I went to the billing department at the hospital and talked to a woman and explained the error. She checked it out and then, right in front of me, she called the debt collector, told them of the hospitals error and told them to cease trying to collect a debt that didn't exist.
HERE IS WHERE THE REAL PROBLEM COMES IN. Debt collectors are lazy and do most phone calls by computer. When they have no success in collection they will sell that debt to another collector. They package the one's they don't want and sell those debts for pennies on the dollar. The collectors that buy these are the lower scumbags on the collection food chain....the one's that use illegal and unscrupulous methods to harass people.
Now....the original debt collector that was told to cease any more attempts to collect anything from me SOLD my debt in one of his noncollectable packages. AND, that has continued to happen......for 14 YEARS! I have received daily phone calls for 14 years to collect a debt that I never owed. They find out that I don't owe anything and it is flipped into a "sell package" and is bought up by another collector. If it wasn't so serious it would be humorous....I have gone through a chain of 7 or 8 collectors over the years more times than I can count. These dumb asses just keep buying and selling my paper work over and over without EVER removing it as a no debt.
I have seen a lot of scumbag tricks over the years. I have a friend and she has been in the business of debt collection for years. A very nice lady that listens to people and does not ever harass. Over the years she has collected an enormous file on the rotten tricks that the unscrupulous bottom feeders use. You would be ASTOUNDED at some of the things these people will do to other people. I mean really ASTOUNDED. Space prevents me from telling you some of the purely evil things these people will do.

I don't doubt you at all. I knew some people who quit because they did not have the stomach for it.

I benefitted from being contacted with a collector who could not overcome the immorality, and quit. My debt vanished with her.

You must understand that the system is in place to exploit the weakest. You must further understand that traps are laid. You must further understand that this is a function of from lack of resources. People starve from lack of money. That is manipulated and one reason this must end. The people at the top are not inherently evil, but they are corrupted by the system they inhabit. Because the system of money has outgrown its usefulness and has become a bane. Kinda like two drinks for fun and socializing, six drinks and no fun and no socializing. Time to boot money. Venus Project.

Tammy...You should always pay your bills. If for no other reason than peace of mind. But that isn't always possible when you are overwhelmed by increases in the cost of living that prices you out of the affordable living range.

My natural gas bill 3 years ago in the worst month of winter barely made it to $150. Now with 3 rate increases, it's $400. How does that not create debt?

You cite a very narrow view of your family cash flow. Businesses have to make choices all the time about their cash flow. Input costs change. They have to make decisions on how to manage those changes.

The question I would ask is what did you do to change your personal situation? Just curious, were you the only one the who had their gas bill go up?

sjacobs...I had a family and owned a business for 12 years. What changed my financial status? A divorce. Any divorced woman would tell you that unless you remarry in haste, the first decade after a divorce when you are the custodial parent is a horror. I was lucky enough to have some prior business skills. Some are not so lucky.

I know all about business cashflow...I'm an office manager in a small environmental engineering company. I do the accounting among a list of other things on an "as needed basis". The cost of healthcare has taken a huge chunk out of my paycheck and in effect, seriously reduced my salary. Not the employer's fault. He's a small businessman. He did what he could to prevent it. It was $50 copays for doctors, $5,000 for hospital and $40 for any prescriptions or shut the 37 year old business down. And all why? So the cash flow of HMOs could provide them with enough to gamble with high risk Wall Street investments.

No..First Energy bought PSE&G. PSE&G asked for and received 3 rate increases in less than 3 years. That cuts into paychecks big time. In other words, I'm supporting First Energy CEOs.

You will pardon my resentment at reaching near retirement age and facing that even without any credit card debt, utilities and healthcare may bankrupt me.

My sympathies are with you if you have acted responsibly. Unfortunately, this puts you in the very small minority of people crying victim.

sjacobs...I don't see myself as a victim. Every time someone rips me off, I fight back. I don't stand by silently and allow scam artists to think they committed the perfect crime. As someone savvy in business, they usually rue the day they ever met me. I may look like a windup doll being small and all but I'm a firm believer in giving as good as I get.

How nice for you, Tammy. BUT...these collectors make MISTAKES. Read my post #7.3 and you may understand that some of these collectors are unethical to say the least.

ewent - Quite to the contrary, I was a single mother who received no child support and no government assistance. I worked my way through school and simply did not spend beyond my means...I had to pay daycare and sometimes I just didn't get everything I wanted. I assure you I pay utilities as well... the utility companies are not the ones beating down your door and seeking you out on facebook! Infact, you will notice that utility payments do not reflect on your credit history. This is a cop out for all the people who wrack up debt living a lifestyle they have not earned. I understand bad things happen, I have had to work with creditors in the past and I have never been harassed as long as I PAY!

Sja....

Venus Project. See yourself.

Cu Hoi!

Jen...Lose your job, have your old man walk out on you with a mouth to feed or get into a serious accident where you can't work. I'm so glad you are so fortunate to never have any debt, misfortune or illness. Guess what sweets? You're going to get old. You can be young and poor. But you can't be old and poor. Get it now?

When you say scumbags who don't pay their bills, were you referring to Congress, by chance?

Michael Coats...So should Congress not pay Halliburton for their bills? XE? A ton of other privatized vendors all snacking away at the Swiss Cheese tax revenues?

It's time to call it like it is. The last time the US had a balanced budget and zero debt was 1835 when Jackson was president. But he ended his presidency with the first 6-year depression.

If you study that closely, you find an eerie sameness then as now. When Jackson had a surplus, he handed it back to the states who went on spending sprees until zip was left. Jackson thought if he consolidated all state debts and paid from the federal government, he could achieve his goal of zero debt. He did. But it didn't take long for a suplus to amass that ended up back in states' hands who spent like the second coming of a Wild Cat Gold Strike.

The problem is the same today. Some states are nearly fully subsidized by the federal government while others are struggling to meet their federal tax obligations. Yet, these same states receiving all those subsidies brag about how low their state taxes are. Well...duh.....sure...when other states' subsidize theirs, that's easy to claim.

Since you are so well off, maybe you should volunteer your time and extra funds to help those who are in need. Those who have medical bills that are outrageous, those with energy bills that have quadrupled over the years. Oh I know...you are better than everyone else and you really have no clue how real people survive. So glad that your offspring will have the money to pay that $5 a gallon of gas and eat and pay for a place and pay thier bills on that first minimum wage job they'll need to take to build a job history. Frankly this country could use less people like you.

Where in the article does it say she is "in need" or has medical bills? All it says is that she fell behind in her car payments. The bottom line is she didn't pay and didn't contact the company or answer their calls to work out a payment plan, so they had to resort to other means to try and reach her. This whole situation is completely her fault. Now she gets to sue the company that she owes money to for trying to collect that money?? That is just ridiculous.

Jen335...Clue for you to ponder. Check out any of your loans, credit cards, etc. If they have not been refinanced at today's interest rates, you are very likely responsible for at least 18% interest for credit cards and at least 10% for other types of loans. So when you "fall behind", which can be as little as 10 days, you are already being accrued late charges at that rate of interest. If your monthly credit card bill was $30, that means that if you fall behind one month, at today's credit card rates, you'd owed almost double that.

If you can't recover your losses sooner than 90 days, it automatically goes into credit and collections if not sooner, depending on the company.

I pay all my credit cards in full each month because I budget properly, so I do not pay interest. If you are charging up your credit card and only pay the minimum payment that's a bad habit to begin with. Then you fall behind and your minimum payment doubles so you can't afford it? That's no one's fault but your own. Learn to live within your means.

Jen....I'm not one of the daycare generation. I don't have credit card debt. I only usually need a credit card when I travel to rent a car since no car rental will rent one without a credit card.

I have feeling you like preaching about "living within your means" when you pay your credit card every month. Do without your Tivo, that Ipad, the Beamer, the daycare center that does the job you should be doing and the Dolce & Gabbanas. Then preach about living within your means. You young ones don't have a clue. How many meals did you actually prepare from scratch this week? How many times did you mow your own lawn?

Oh that's right. That McMansion you just had to have means you have to have a double income and you work. Boo hoodles. Learn to live on one income. Then talk.

See? There's more to your gospel of living within your means than preaching about it and praising yourself when you aren't living within yours.

Where in the article does it say she is "in need" or has medical bills? All it says is that she fell behind in her car payments. The bottom line is she didn't pay and didn't contact the company or answer their calls to work out a payment plan, so they had to resort to other means to try and reach her. This whole situation is completely her fault. Now she gets to sue the company that she owes money to for trying to collect that money?? That is just ridiculous.

What's ridiculous is ppl commenting on articles they obviously haven't read or comprehended.

The woman did work out a pymt agreement & was harassed on FB after she did so, which is why she called a lawyer & sued. They did not have to "resort to other means to try & reach her" when they already had all her contact info & the matter was settled to mutual satisfaction.

And your pt would be what? Showing off the merits of your education system?

I love these ppl who think they're inviolable & nothing bad will ever happen to them & life will be wonderful. Guess what? Dream on. Bad things happen. Sometimes they're bad enough that you might miss one pymt *gasp* on a bill. Sometimes it's going to be a whole lot worse than that. What are you going to say then when someone gets in your face & starts bleating about how you should've lived within your means & better prepared yourself for that trip thru chemo?

Well said Scar Tissue. For Jen, Norm, Auto, and all the other perfect and utterly untouchable folks spewing their bile before they chew all the info they've just read, please note that unless you work for Wall Street or Washington, a good 80% of us or more are ALL just a job loss, an illness, a parent dying, or an accident away from being BROKE with NO OPTIONS to get out. You might want to get off your high horses and start thinking how you'll afford to heat the gaping holes in your glass houses if the @#$? starts raining down on you. Just sayin'.

ewent - you think you know me, but you don't have the first clue. I was never in daycare, and I don't have any of those things you mentioned - I don't have cable, I do have a cell phone but I got the free one that came with the basic plan, not a smart phone with a data plan. my car is a 2006 and is not a bmw, and I rarely go shopping for clothes, and when I do I go to places like old navy and TJ maxx. I prepare most of my meals from scratch and look in the circulars and clip coupons every week for groceries. The McMansion you are referring to doesn't exist either. My husband and I bought a 2 family home and we live in the small 1 bedroom side of the house while renting out the other to save money. We both are fortunate enough to have decent jobs, but we also work hard maintaining our own small business. oh and I mow my own lawn, don't have a maid or a chef or whatever you are thinking about me. We are very fortunate I know but we also work very hard, try to budget, and have also managed to save an emergency fund. I am definitely living within my means, and even if I had all those things you mentioned and I could afford them them I would still be living within my means, right? So really your argument has no merit.

Scar/Oh Please - I did miss that section about her working out a payment plan before she was contacted on FB, you are right about that, but what does that have to do with chemo? How do you know she is sick? Maybe she spent all her money on cigarettes. I know people behind on payments who smoke, and in NJ rates are almost $8 a pack, then a pack a day would cost $240 a month!! Did you ever think this might be why she couldn't afford her car payment?? We have no idea about the background of her circumstances and I sincerely hope that it is not due to illness. I would think that if it was they would have made a point to mention that in the article to play up her role as a victim in this situation.

scar tissue - I see she made a payment plan with the debt collectors, but did she bother to call the car company and work something out with them before it was sent to collections? I'm guessing she didn't. She probably only worked out a payment plan with the debt collectors because she was tired of the harassment.

So Jen, sounds like you are saying you can be a scumbag without effort. That's the system. You enforce it. You accept it.

Guido tells Mario to make a hit. If Mario doesn't then Carmine takes care of Mario. That's the way it works. That does not make it legitimate. The current finacial system (monetary system) is corrupt. You are playing Guido.

My apologies to the Italian community.

I'm don't quite get the mob reference, but I know that I pay my bills and expect others to do the same. If you can't pay then you at least try to work out a payment plan with the person or company you owe. You don't hide and hope it goes away and then get upset when you are hounded by debt collectors.

There are way too many people in our society who feel that they deserve things without having to work for them.

Actual most original debt holders will not work with you

Corporations (business) take my debt everytime they take profit. A corporation sets all this in motion by making debt unrepayable (interest).

"We do it all for you!" Really? Not for money?

"Have it your way!" Really? What if I want a chutney?

Vote Dem or Rep. Like there is a choice there.

"We will protect you - but not from us." That is the truth.

Facebook doesn't make you do any of those things. Maybe people should control what they're sharing? Weird idea, I know.

Is anyone with a real life actually still doing facebook? The last time I went on there one of my "friends" actually regaled us all with details of going out for a pizza the night before! If these types are dumb enough to go on facebook then no wonder they are dumb enough to have bill collectors after them.

Barbara...Do what I did. I told them I had them on phone record (which you have to do if you actually do that) and then tell them you're on the other line with the Federal Trade Commission. Watch how fast they hang up.

i've been there as well, and unfortunate things do happen. But you're entering into a financial contract as an adult. so doesnt that company have a right, to try and get their money? does she have a right to continue driving the car? they don't have a right to be offensive or go overboard with harassing you, i agree. there are a lot of good people out there who WANT to pay their bills and can't. there's also a lot of people who can pay their bills but won't.

amy...The company you contracted with isn't the one who is doing the collecting. The company sold that debt to collectors. So the company is already paid. It's the collector who has to not only get what was owed but thensome in profit if they can. The government has to clamp down on the amount of profit these jerks can make from debt they bought from those companies.

Well said. The original company is long out of this process, they've sold the debt to the collection agencies, and it can just keep getting sold and sold and sold, for pennies on the dollar, as some other posters have mentioned...

I agree. Who wants to live the American Dream anyways? Damn all you people who wanted your kids to have something you might not have had. Let's just start voting "Smart People" into office so we don't have to think anymore for ourselves.

Who wants to live the American Dream anyways?

The dreamof owning a home is only achieved by 1/3 of the 67% of American that "own a home" the rest rent to own from the bank.

Auto101...In 1966, we bought a home for $18,500. As a result of an auto accident recently, I had to buy another car....price tag? $19,000. The used car that got wrecked was already 4 years old and I had just put $1600 into it the month before some Ahole in a fat butt bully boy Silverado took it out and me nearly with it.

In 1966, my property taxes were $345/yr. After my divorce, I paid off that first mortgage in 1996. By the, the property taxes were $437/month. If salaries increased as quickly as utilities and property taxes do, no one would be in debt. The reality is that if your salary stagnates and nothing else does, you will be in debt. That's a no brainer.

Ewent - Where do you live that your property taxes are $437 per month? HOLY COW! Mine are $633 every 6 months.

ewent:
"If salaries increased as quickly as utilities and property taxes do, no one would be in debt." I agree! Halfway... Yes, I understand that salaries stagnate while inflation takes a bigger chunk out of our everyday expenses. It sucks. They have us by the throat and every year (or more frequently) come and tell us, "sorry, gotta raise prices...Inflation". Who here was able to walk into the boss's office and say the same thing? "Yeah, Bill I'm gonna have to charge you more to keep working here." Ha!

But we are, for the most part, a "gotta have it now" society. We don't have the money, so we buy now and pay later. Then there are unfortunate, unforeseen occurances... So debt will still come. Of course, this doesn't apply to the perfect ones who pay cash for everything and plan for every possible contingency. I applaud you and wish you'd share your secrets with those you consider "less responsible".

The banks, for the most part, made their beds. They know what they're getting into when they issue a loan. That's why they charge interest rates. It's a charge for taking a risk. A risk of default! In the years leading up to the housing and mortgage crisis, they were GIVING away ARM's to many underqualified people. Did they really think that all this lending to otherwise underqualified people wouldn't backfire? Give the 5/1 ARM to someone with questionable credit, and tell them that they'll build good credit in those first 5 years. Then they can refinance because "property values always go up" and "after paying a mortgage for 5 years, you'll have great credit!". 5 years later, the option to refinance wasn't there, and the interest rate adjusted up. Now they're paying more for the house... But that's not the bank's fault. After all, these adults signed the promise to pay (even though they were bamboozled into a false sense of security by the banking professional who knows better). The banks knew what they were doing, and they knew the government would bail them out in the event of a backfire (which it did, and they were bailed out).

The "rapid refund" tax refunds are the same, albeit on a smaller scale. They prey on the folks who they know want the money NOW. And let's face it, there's probably a good reason. But what happens when the amount they get turns out to be a fraction of the original amount? I've never had to do this (thankfully), but explain the justification of taking 50% of the pie for fronting the money for a few weeks. 50% might be a high guess, but I don't know the actual.

I feel for those of you who own businesses and have issues trying to collect delinquent payments. I know the process can potentially create a domino effect, making you look bad and suffer in the process. This isn't directed towards any of you. I'm talking more along the lines of the LARGE corporations taking advantage of the less fortunate and trampling the taxpayers on their high horses while collecting handouts from us. The woman in the article worked out an agreement to pay, THEN the collectors started harassing her on FB? Now that's low....

Actually I don't work for a bank or credit card company. I work full time plus I run a small property management company in my "spare time" and I depend on my tenant's payments to pay my bills. When they don't pay on time and I they won't answer my calls it makes me angry, and I can see why this company would also be angry and trying anything to get the money that is owed to them. I think if the woman in the article had done the responsible thing and called to let them know she would be paying late or to work out a payment plan I don't think they would have sent the account to collection. From that company's side it must have looked like she was just going to keep the car and not pay.

Oh genius, perfect Jen - if you'd bothered to completely read and/or comprehend the article, it clearly states that this woman had already worked out a payment plan to responsibly pay her debt that she knew she owed, and the company then proceeded to harass her, her friends and family on Facebook. That's why she is suing the debt collection company. Perhaps you might try to digest information for a sec before vehemently spewing it back out and calling people scumbags. And you might pray that some god awful accident or situation doesn't befall you or your parents in which your savings, your income, and everything else is totally wiped out and then you're the "scumbag" who doesn't pay their bills.

Actually I don't work for a bank or credit card company. I work full time plus I run a small property management company in my "spare time" and I depend on my tenant's payments to pay my bills. When they don't pay on time and I they won't answer my calls it makes me angry, and I can see why this company would also be angry and trying anything to get the money that is owed to them. I think if the woman in the article had done the responsible thing and called to let them know she would be paying late or to work out a payment plan I don't think they would have sent the account to collection. From that company's side it must have looked like she was just going to keep the car and not pay.

O, so you're one o those ppl who thought getting into the slumlord business would be a good way to have discretionary income?

Let me give you a little advice: I wouldn't ans your calls, either, honey. Too much self-righteous 'tude going on there. Tone it down, you might get somewhere w/ these ppl you expect to pay your bills for you. "Getting angry" is no way to run a successful business. Neither is pouting, stamping your feet, or harassment.

And what part of the article did you not read that you keep repeating the same incorrect info over & over? All of it? What you insist happened is not what was reported.

I am not a slumlord. I bought older houses and put a lot of time, money, and effort into them to improve them, and I respond to any tenant issues right away.

Yes I expect them to pay their rent because they signed a lease that said they would do so. What, you think I should let them live there for free? And I don't get angry if they tell me they are going to pay late. I only get mad if they don't pay, and don't get in contact with me to let me know, and don't answer the phone when I call. That makes me think they are intending to live there without paying, and this has happened before.

I know it. I had to do the same thing with my credit situation out of college. But how come the banks get away with the bailouts, then bonus their execs for doing a fine job? They're certainly getting help without investing any of their own. The auto execs who flew their private jets to DC and walked into the Capitol with their hands out?

Your logic is certainly reasonable. I just wish it was applied across the board is all...

wat cold heartless bastards are out there? ur right, when s/one got it good cause of luck or watever its "Hooray for me and HELL wit you"...kindler, gentler nation..shame.

I heard about it, in fact my student loans came due right in the middle of it! I had to get a job and took one in the interim that was not on my chosen career path, nor was it high paying, so that I could pay the bills while looking for another job.

Plenty of people do this.

I'd say personal responsibility went out the window when the banks got trillions of dollars in bailouts and then paid themselves multi-million-dollar bonuses -- for doing a LOUSY JOB!

Butterfly...In a way, I'm glad I never went to college. I'm autodidactic. I can teach myself enough to survive and enough to take care of my needs. I cannot possibly imagine being saddled with the kind of debt our kids are coming out of college with. It almost makes a college degree seem all the more worthless in light of how few jobs are accommodating the dearth of college grads today.

"I'd say personal responsibility went out the window when the banks got trillions of dollars in bailouts and then paid themselves multi-million-dollar bonuses -- for doing a LOUSY JOB!"

BINGO!

“…a few bad collectors get hired…” WHAT… you really believe that don’t you? Here’s my story… I was “hounded” by a collection agency for over 3 years (2004 – 2007) for $4,000… whenever I talked to these people and asked them to prove that I actually owed anybody any money all they would say is we have the proof and all of the documents we need… screwed up my credit for a while. The only problem was that it was somebody else they were supposed be hounding. I hired and attorney who specialized in “Collection Agencies” and when he was done with them a court ordered them to pay me $50,000, clear my credit history of all past references to this “debt” and pay ALL court and attorney costs.

The only thing that I had in common with the person they really wanted was that we had the same name and birth date… we never lived in the same places… SSN’s were not even close… difference race… nothing in common, so I hope that she gets a very big pay day regardless whether she’s right or wrong, somebody needs to bring these people under control.

You are exactly right! My tenants can't pay their rent on time and won't answer my calls, but then I see them with new cars and smart phones, oh and they love to crank the heat up to high and leave it on all day with the door open so I'm sure their electric bill is under control. It is all about personal responsibility, using your brain, and budgeting.

Jen335...Why can't your tenants pay their rent on time?

Jen335...Why can't your tenants pay their rent on time?

I bet they can pay it on time. I bet they just enjoy aggravating her & watching her explode into an emotional fireball, since it seems to be such an EZ thing to do LOL

Maybe they're invoking a warrant of habitability & she hasn't noticed? Seems like it's all about what the tenants can do for her lifestyle from what I've read so far.

ewent - i guess they can't pay their rent on time because they don't budget their money, and they spend it on other things, like beer and cigarettes, and just plain stupidity like I mentioned above like heating the outdoors

scar tissue - wrong. i have significantly improved the building since I bought it and will continue to do so. why am I in the wrong - I am the mean landlord right because I expect people to pay to live in my buildings? I do my part, and I expect others to do theirs.

Rachel, there is no 'right to hound'. According to Federal law, if you request a debt collector to cease all communication and contact attempts, that collector is obliged to honor the request. It must be in writing. They do have the right to sue - within the boundaries of the statute of limitations - but there is no 'right to hound'.

But is it is the original creditor I believe the law is different than third party's (so My parents have been told by a lawyer).

Unless you were on the original contract, that's illegal. Go read the FDCPA.

Auto, I believe you are right. The FDCPA only covers third-party collection agencies, not original creditors.

I get collection calls for some of my neighbors. I live in an apt bldg, so I reckon they must think they hit the jackpot when they stumble across me listed w/ the same address or something. Like I'm going to knock on doors of ppl I don't even know (just recognize the names off mailboxes) & tell them to pay their bills? They're wasting their time babbling to my voice mail. How idiotic a tactic is that? B/c you find a landline listing at the same address as your debtor, you call it? Duhhh.

The women in the article in not Innocent she is a deadbeat.

Auto101...So is Exxon-Mobil. The government is still waiting for full payment of their numerous spills. Individual debtors don't have taxpayers to bail them out with their bills, why does Exxon?

it is called politicians they are about as scummy as lawyers.

Auto101...The politicians don't owe that money. Exxon-Mobil does. Exxon is just smart enough to spend as much as they can to lobbyists to reduce what they owe. No individual can do that. Exxon-Mobil has no excuse for not paying its debts. Not when they reported 2 fiscal quarters of record profits into the hundred billions. Pay what you owe...isn't that what you are preaching?