Well, this was bound to happen after Obama and his welfare stormtroopers expropriated the auto companies and the banks. Ever notice that they didn't take-over any of Hugo Chavez's Citgo stations? Well, I don't believe in conspiracies, but you be the judge.
I'm glad to see a reasonable amount and that the family saw it for what it was a simple accident. This could have been solved by not having two mats in the drivers side as the dealership did. I hope that the rest of the vultures out there will leave this family alone now that the amount has been made public.
I own my third Lexus, love the car. Hey, the company was liable and paid. Haven't all the car companies had problems. This country allows you to buy any car you want, Japanese, American German, whatever. Do your homework and pick the car.
If you are overly concerned about safety, stay home under the blankets. Everything is a risk, enjoy the ride or take a bus.
Your so right. At least they did not wait 20 years before fessing up like GM and those side mounted gas tanks. Oh yeah we all forgot about all those poor souls who lost their lives in trucks catching on fire. Did you see GM step up and pay out to all those who lost loved ones. NO! THEY DID NOT, they sent all the registered owners of those trucks a $1000 certificate Rebate towards the purchase of a new GM vehicle. Oh Boy Whoopie I just got a $1000 dollars to use if I buy a truck from GM after they fried Grand Pa. At least Toyota stepped up. I worked for them and they will pay when its their fault. They are good about taking care of business. Especially when it comes to their reputation as a Car Manufacturer.
I happen to have taken my Lexus in for scheduled maintenance today. The give me loaner, a brand new Lexus, and charge me nothing. The do excellent work, clean the car no charge. I will say that a $20 oil change costs $35 but the overall value is there. And today's maintenance was not cheap. I have had the car 6 years with no problems. Rides really smooth. You can say what you want about Toyota. My experience has been excellent.
What is your experience or are you just ranting? And what makes the company suck, did you work there?
sorry you're so upset about your jap toyota company...my GM car is the budget Calvalier 1999 that I bought new and still running fine today with over 150,000 miles and thats a 2.2 4 cyl...which I still get over 30 mpg....and when I buy a new one it will be another GM car and one made in the us as I will research which ones are....I believe a car is only as good as you take care of it..and I take good care of mine...
I don't know why you think I am upset with the Jap company. I still don't know why you are upset with the Jap company. And I am glad that your experience with GM has been good. I am a strong Patriot of this country. I just happen to believe that if I can afford to buy and maintain a good car, the Jap Lexus is a good buy. That is Capitalism. I buy American whenever it is practical. I think we are both proud Americans, and America is about choice.
A company that commits fraud is not to be trusted. $10,000,000.00 is pocket change to them. It's like you handing a dollar to a homeless guy; shallow and ineffective.
Toyota has claimed that their cars do not unintentionally accelerate unless the gas pedal is trapped under the floor mat or there is driver error. In this case it seems that since this incident took place over such a prolonged period of time the pedal is unlikely to have been the cause nor does driver error seem to fit. Is this an admittance by Toyota that there may be a third scenario causing these issues?
Todd, read the article: "Investigators determined that a wrong-size floor mat trapped the accelerator and caused the crash". There was nothing wrong with the Lexus. There is no ghost in the machine. The Lexus dealer put a non-factory floormat in the vehicle which slid up and trapped the accelerator. And for what it's worth, this has happened many times in the past with many different makes and models of vehicles. The Toyota story was blown out of proportion by an opportunistic NHTSA and media.
marc, I am so tired of hearing this. You can mat the accelerator in any modern automobile and the braking system will over power the drive-train...unless there is something wrong.
Todd, your right. The brake system will override the power train in any modern vehicle. So why did'nt the driver push the brake? He could have stopped the vehicle and saved his and his family's lives.
Actually I do not understand why he did not place the vehicle in neutral and apply the brake or turn off the ignition before the vehicle reached an unmanageable speed.
brakes were reported to be on fire they had been depressed for so long and hard trying to overcome the engine. No key to turn off the vehicle as it had a button to start it and you need to press the button for 3 seconds for it to shut off. Unfortunately no one told the driver this little fact, and when a car's engine races out of control your adrenaline will take over and not give you the presence of mind to start looking into the owner's manual.
Agree with Auto, I sold Toyota's for a long time. If you did not place the mats in correctly and most did not know this, if you failed to install the catch clip which will mount to the floors carpet to keep the floor mat stretched taught towards the drivers seat. They may find out that many where improperly installed during Pre- Delivery Inspection that is performed at Dealer level. I know that alot of dealers would leave it up to the Salesperson to put the mats in and install the catch clip. Not a great scenario for QC.
I think this entire country needs a logical enema. Has anybody ever heard of personal responsibility? How can you even consider that driver error was not to blame? Have you ever heard of neutral? What happens to the engine when you turn the key off? I wonder if the guy didn't go psychotic and just decide to kill off the whole fam damily. I can't believe a highway patrolman didn't have better sense than that.
But you people think it was a fair award? Yesireee! America the sue happy. Maybe I should crush my thumb with a hammer and sue Stanley for making such a dangerous tool without guards. Or I could cut my leg off with a chain saw and sue Stihl for making the chain sharp. Oh, I know - I'll drink 10 gallons of water, keel over, then sue the city for not regulating it (or at least my kids can sue if I die)! The dumb a$$es on an American jury will give me millions. Hell, I have a thousand percent better chance of getting rich from frivolous lawsuits than winning the lottery!
Yep! Three generations of public schooling has just about dumbed us down to the mentally retarded range.
marc, I am so tired of hearing this. You can mat the accelerator in any modern automobile and the braking system will over power the drive-train...unless there is something wrong.
Todd,
With the throttle full open the brake system pressure falls off. This makes the brakes seem to not work, and you are required to push them to the floor to get any response. They will stop the car in this condition, but it is not easy. The fact that the brakes were on fire tells me he was most likely not using enough pressure, allowing the brakes to over heat from friction without actually generating enough force to noticeably slow the car.
And before you say it, I don't work for the dealership, I don't work for Lexus, and I drive a Saab. It's a stick shift.
I have however performed this little test in test drives of most cars I've ever considered buying. Call me crazy, but brake perfomance and brake fade are the kind of thing I pay attention to.
Why didn't the driver just put it in neutral? The gas may have stuck, and the brakes failed, but a car can always be placed in neutral. It's just one click forward from Drive, for Pete's sake!
Vehicles don't go from 60-100 mph in the blink of an eye. BTW- I don't have to assume what I WOULD have done - I already know. When they say "don't panic," they really mean it. I am sorry for this family's loss, but unfortunately, not everyone knows how to act at the time of a crisis. Next time you pass an injury accident, see how many people stop to help vs how many just slow down to get a good look-sie. Some people in life are simply spectators, other's: participants.
I agree, turn the key off, push the "start" button, put it in neutral, something other than riding the thing to death! There are lots of things that could have been done, speculation at best at this point. People died needlessly and all they would have had to do is keep their cool and turn the damn thing off. I had a situation where the throttle stuck at 100% and the speed started to increase from 55mph up to 70mph before I turned the key off, coasted to the side of the freeway and got it fixed...No one died, no fire, no drama at all......
Interesting that many forget what happens in a panic situation. Those who have had near misses know what happens. Your seat sucks up into your rectum just before you wreck em.
Actually, I have had several near misses (usually the other guys fault) and never did freak out. I hit a mountain on black ice once. Stayed cool calm and collected before, during, and after. Just couldn't quite get it in control. Some people don't have the gene I guess.
If the driver had enough time to be talking for an extended period with the 911 operator, he certainly had enough time to figure out whether a stuck floor mat was causing the accelerator to jam, and more than enough time to shift into neutral.
Tim count it out 6 seconds, that is a prettly long time, plus there was a cop in the car where was his training then? Sure people panic but you had a trained office that is trained to pursue people at fast speeds. Yeha 6 seconds is fast but not that fast.
I sure hope they do something smart with that money. If there are any surviving children (or young cousins, nieces, nephews, grandchildren, etc.), the money should be put into a 529 plan for them.
Good idea!!! Most broke people that get money like this just turn up broke because they don't save their money and do what you just said. Pay off all debt, save, save, save!!
I wish Toyota would own up that there is a real problem with their throttle system and quit saying the wrong size floor mat causes the problem. Toyota and or the supplier of the throttle system needs to do something other than blame a floor mat. Sure a floor mat can impede the throttle pedal if it gets in the way, but a floor is not going to give maximum acceleration to speeds of over 120 mph. Something in the throttle system malfunctioned, plain and simple!!!
None of the government engineers can find a fault with the throttle system. If you know what it is then it's your responsibility to inform the engineers.
The proof is in the money trail, Toyota paid $50 million to the government in fines for not telling them material disclosures about their faulty product. If they didn't have a problem why did they hid reports and internal memos from engineering departments? Why did they settle for 10 million to one family if there isn't a problem with their product?
The basic issue is the control scheme used by toyota on the throttle system.
GM system (also a drive by wire system ) uses zero volts as zero acceleration on the reponse profile. this makes it so if nothing else unplug it works to stop the control loop.
That being said the reported toyota system uses a +5 Volt signal as zero setpoint.
What does this mean you ask ? It means the profile is now inverted and unplugging the device doesn't necessarily work the input will now "float" to some DC voltage determined by the EM Field present.
The entire problem could be resolved by switching to the USA - GM design creteria but the Japanse are too proud to accept our system and they devised thier own.
Gm does not us 0 V as the bottom voltage they use it uses .5 Volts and a 4.5 V as a high any thing out of that sets a fault. Did you know that the pedal Toyota uses has two sensors in it?
Volkswagen is number two in acceleration complaints. There system uses two different base voltage reference signal .5 and 1.2 volts they also have one of the best brake overrides out there.
My 12 year old son makes fun of Toyota everytime they have a commerical on TV to sell cars. They always mention that Toyota is moving forward. My kid says yeah duh because they can't stop! I will never trust a Toyota after this incident. When my kid is old enough to drive it will be a GM auto with OnStar capability. It may end up saving my kids life someday. GM and Ford both have very competitve smaller size vehicles and are definitely worth a look for those needing a car and fuel economy.
JoAnn, GM is only in the business because they screwed their creditors and your kids and grandkids were forced by Obama to bail them out. There was no money in the treasury to pay for this and the other bailouts so it was added to the national debt which now stands at 14 trillion. That is nearly 47 thousand for every man woman and child in the US and about many times that for every taxpayer. Do yourself and your kids a favor and buy the Ford.
Please read George W Bush's book that is in bookstores now, go to near the end and read how he GW Bush, said he knew he had no choice but to save GM, so it was he he took the TARP money and loaned it to them.
The did not all go to washington during 2008 to talk to a president who was not yet elected.
Jo Ann, congradulation's to you and your son. I hope he really does buy a made in USA auto when he become's old enough to drive. Everybody should buy USA made products over import's, IF IT'S POSSIBLE, to keep people working in the USA!
The jap anese transplants are not American they are a seed from japan and 85% of the sales money go's back to their home land, japan. Buy from a American owned company and stop supporting the jap anese economy.
WHAT PROFITS???GM EARNED NO PROFITS WITH THE UAW WHICH IS WHY THEY WENT BANKRUPT!
Thats why I buy from Walmart because its an American company EARNING profits!
Just like GM cars builds in Mexico, Who cares that its made in China when the profits go to the U.S. right?
If GM builds all their cars in Mexico and China while Toyota builds cars in America, you'll still buy GM right ?
I bet you don't care that Chrysler profits will go to Italy as long as UAW members are getting their paychecks... truth is that you support paying UAW workers even if they work for foreign owners but not non-union American workers.
UAW screws over American GM investors too, so you wonder why many dont give a shyt about GM if the UAW works there?
You want to save American auto companies, let them hire Americans who don't want to join the UAW.
You UAW guys are all traitors to demand other Americans lose their jobs and to blackmail American companies into bankruptcies.
I've driven Toyotas since 1984 without any problems like this. I have driven cars where the floor mat made the gas pedal stick (they were all american made), and I reacted in a correct way. I've even had the rear axle come out of a Ford while driving down the road which also caused the brake pedal to go to the floor, and I handled that one without incident. Personally I think this was a driver error but I'll never know the actual facts.
People keep pushing American made cars which in my opinion still can't touch a Toyota or Honda in reliability. And they're being made in the USA so but them and keep those people working.
It's just like the woman with the McDonalds coffee. Yes it's hot, but mom taught me that when it's hot to be careful. Also taught me not to put anything in a wall outlet too but I guess that'll be the next big law suit from someone.
Oh and it's amazing how people forget all the accidents that domestic cars have caused over the years with exploding gas tanks etc.
1. The Dealer installed the incorrect floor mats. So I'm assuming they knew about the mat clips.
2. The same vehicle have PRIOR COMPLAINTS of a sticking throttle.
3. That vehicle did not have the ECM that cancelled the throttle inputs when the brakes were activated. The NEW vehicles do and TOYOTA has reprogrammed many of their prior vehicles ECM to incorporate this.
4. The ECM feature of throttle deactivation when the brakes have been activated was a ACCEPTED INDUSTRY SAFETY FEATURE for over a DECADE.
5. This NEW LOANER had the brake pads burned down to METAL-on-METAL, after the crash. Eye witness reports that the brake lights were ON - prior to the crash.
Do not let the TRUE facts cloud your adoration for TOYOTA.
Hey Mike, I have been driving AMERICAN CARS since the mid 70'S and never had any MAJOR problems with any of them unlike a few foolish friends who paid lots in repairs. SO WHAT IS YOUR POINT.
That was a good decision, but they need to stand by their products better to keep loyal repeat customers. Been a Ford man all my life till they blew it. Bought my wife a new 08 Escape - great car, then my 05 Sport Trac (bought new) started peeling paint at 30,000 miles. Called them, went to dealer. They did nothing! Damn shame. Sooner or later the chickens come home to roost!
More people die in natural disasters everyday is this really news worthy or just a way for low lifes to slam on TOYOTA? REALLY? FORD AND CHEVY killed just as many peple over the years, makes no difference what you drive, stupid people crash and die everyday... I'd Gave them $10.00 settlement for being stupid..
Do this after you ensure your; car, health, and life insurance polices a UP-Dated.
On a deserted multi-lane highway, accelerate to posted speed. Then floor the gas petal and hold it there.
Using your other foot apply the brakes:
1. On a STANDARD ECM (electronic throttle) the throttle input will be deactivated and return engine to the DASH setting. (Fast idle) The brakes will then slow and stop the vehicle. Easily over-riding the slow running engine.
2. On the early TOYOTA the ECM would not deactivate the throttle input. And the Engine would keep running and accelerating until WOT (max allowed throttle). At high throttle settings the engine develops minimum vacuum.
After you apply the vacuum power assisted brakes several times. The vacuum reservoir for the brakes is depleted. Resulting in minimum braking ability. Continued application of the brakes will do NOTHING, even if you apply the parking brake.
BTY - You can return the brakes to NORMAL Function if you allow the throttle to return to a slower engine speed. If your throttle/ECM does not malfunction....
I'm a certified Master Auto Tech - ASE and have been working in the field for decades.
The accumulator/high pressure pump is NOT used , unless the wheel sensors detect the need to pulsate the wheels brake pressure. To prevent wheel lock-up and loss of control.
ABS will not affect how the brake pressure feels when driving normally and is only functional during emergency situations. On the new vehicles every wheel has its own speed sensor. When one or more wheels speed CHANGES these sensors enable the ABS to select which wheel needs to be pumped, to prevent brake induced lock-up.
The ABS accumulator is NOT used for power assist during NORMAL braking. Only for pulsating the pressure when the wheels try to lock-up.
However if the vehicle had power brake assist it would give that pressure that was needed. their for the accumulator gives more pressure to the brake system to help in panic braking and does not pulsate the brakes.
and yes you are right this car dose have a vacuum booster.
By the way I am sorry I keep thinking about the LS line and the way its brakes work. the ES is the more common and many do have the power brake assist.
I WILL NEVER BUY A TOYOTA and I wish everyone in this USA would boycott toyota till there are no more of there cars here. just wait til your loved one is killed because of a toyota then see how you feel.
Eric.......you must have already "forgotten" it was the Pinto that exploded on impact. That was almost 40 years ago and you're still holding on to that?
If that is the case let's go back to December 7 1941 and blame the japs for all the battleship sinking and deaths that day. No different that the Muslim extremists that crashed the twin towers.............gotta love the Japs and their Toyotas
It is tragic what happened to that officer and his family. However, it is HIS FAULT! Any CHP who is too stupid to know how to put a car into Neutral is beyond help! I own a Toyota and and Lexus. Never had finer cars, including Chevy, Pontiac, Mercedes and VW. I bought the Lexus and Toyota *after* this incident. Completely satisfied!
Have you read about that particular model before making this very uneducated and blatantly ignorant comment? That particular model has a safety feature to KEEP THE CAR FROM TURNING OFF. The driver was not aware of that feature and, in fact, tried multiple times to turn the car off or put it into neutral. He was unable to put the car in neutral because of the safety feature as well. Of course he was a skilled driver, more skilled than you are I since he was highly trained. Why do you think the jury awarded $10m? Maybe you are smarter than a group of your peers (the jury) but I seriously doubt it.
@A-Person -- You are an incredibly uncompassionate person. Have you ever been in that situation? You should think about what you're saying before you make such a moronic statement.
Strange that a state trooper didn't know how to slow/stop a car. I'd have tried all of these: down shift, shift into neutral, brake, turn off engine. It's not like the car can accelerate that fast that you wouldn't have time to react.
JoAnn: tell your kid that brakes are there for a reason, to stop the car. Also, tell him that Ford Mustangs are great for burn outs, and power slides (drifting). He'll love ya for it!!
Get over the exploding gas tank and move on to something newer like the explorer rollovers. More to the point , the article is not about who's at fault. It's about a judge deciding to make public the settlement amount and the people not personally involved thinking it's their right to know how much the settlement was for.
We all want to buy american, yet circumstance$ make us look elsewhere. Reason: quality and more bang for the buck. Toyota made some mistakes, but their track record is better than our domestic carmakers. The UAW are their own worst enemy! They protect mediocracy. Lived 6 years in Japan. Their number one carmaker is Toyota. Their has got to be a reason for that. It's longevity! Cars are a major investment anymore. Nissan is not even close.
I work for a Honda dealer and can assure you at least Ford has gone by when it comes to quality. The Japs are living on reputations of yesteryears. If what I see on a daily basis continues american car companies will be at least 1-2 in the world again within 8-10 years.
Ridiculous. 10M for people who couldnt find the brake pedal or the ignition switch. Its a sad day when people are not held responsible for the way they drive their cars. Good thing for them I wasnt on that jury.
To mark: Mark, lets say you buy a hand gun and it jams. Instead of unjamming it the proper way, the safe way that will not get you killed, you look down the barrel and put a bullet in your brain. Now whos fault is it that you did the dumb thing? The gun manufacturer?
Did your gun happen to jam while traveling at 120mph+??
I think an example such as yours is complete nonsense as a comparison.
As a much better example....... lets say that the gun manufacture had prior knowledge of their product not only jamming but going off by itself and they don't reveal this to the buying public. Now what do you have to say?
I have been driving for about 50 years. I have had the experience a several times where the accelerator pedal got stuck under a floor mat. It took me all of maybe a second and a half to reach down and pull the floor mat back to un-stick the gas pedal.
I find it hard to believe that a hiway patrol officer who is supposed to be experienced and knowledgeable in driving would not do the same thing I did instinctively. In fact, it boggles my mind.
I do not think the officer was driving but I would think that it would be instinctive to try to stop using the brake system or just putting it in neutral or even turning off the ignition, I have had experiences with older cars where the motor mounts have broken and this has jammed the accelerator pedal and I simply reached down and pulled it up and if that did not work I popped the car in neutral.
"I find it hard to believe that a highway patrol officer who is supposed to be experienced and knowledgeable in driving would not do the same thing I did instinctively. In fact, it boggles my mind."
Maybe the fact it boggles the mind indicates there was more to the evidence than we know about...that and $10 mil. If there was an indication that the driver was incompetent, there wouldn't have been much of an award.
The TOYOTA has a 'Electronic Throttle and Shifter control'. The CHP Office was driving a vehicle that had a HISTORY of throttle control/ECM problems.
If the ECM malfunctioned, he could have LOST Control of BOTH the throttle and transmission. Maybe even effecting the ability to TURN-OFF the IGNITION. Only TOYOTA really knows...
To infer that he PANICKED is BS. He had the foresight to call 911 and inform the Dispatcher of what was happening, during the incident. The recording of this call was published by the Media.
The NEW "Electronic Control' vehicles are NOT the same vehicle it was even 6+years ago. The same as comparing a Cessna to a 777, NO COMPARISON.
They Transmission still has a mechanical linkage. only the shift pattern and gear selection is controlled by the TCM this is the way almost all 2000 vehicles and up ASE refuse to recognize the TCM being the master mind of the Transmission they still think it is the Valve body.
I can't believe you two. Jap rides and gook Korean rides. You two disgust me to no end. You are what is wrong with this Nation. Your stupid racist comments. Well if the Domestics had done a better job of building cars and not waited till they got our tax dollars to stay in business. I have been in the Automotive Industry for 27 years. I will say this. The domestics are better now then they where by far in the 80's. Yet they still have a long ways to go. If I was going to purchase a Domestic vehicle I would not buy Government Motors or Fix it Again Tony owned Chrysler. The Japanese and Koreans have made the Domestics get off their duffs and build a better car. The only domestic car worth owning is Ford! They did not take money and they are going after the likes of Toyota. FYI if you two rednecks are going to tell me that's why jobs are overseas, your more ignorant then I thought.Toyota and the other foreign manufacturers now operate more factories here in the USA then the Domestics, ask Mexico , Canada, and China how our jobs are doing,. Ford is the only one who has gone on record to begin opening their domestic idled plants again. Go sit down drink your Budweiser and watch some bowl games and stay away from the computer.
has nothing to do with whats made here or not, Suk Toyotas is a Japanese company, and the only reason they open plants here was so they can say Hey! we makey cars in usa now!...and with all the tax credits they got , you got a lot of gall to say anything about the domestic bailouts..the japanese and Korea's got plenty of Tax(bailout)cut money..for their plants and the people they hired..watch when all them cuts run out and they pull a China-mart and move those jobs to china...
I can't believe a state trooper couldn't push the shift lever into neutral. He found time to call on a cell phone to tell someone he couldn't stop, he had plenty of time to shift out of drive even if he couldn't shut the car off. Very sad ending for a trained driver.
Is there a possibility that the transmission was somehow frozen in drive? I'm sure whoever he spoke to on the phone would suggest to put it in neutral. Why didn't the brakes stop or at least slow down the car so he could run it into something? Many times a "disaster" is not caused by one issue, but an unfortunate chain of issues.
How dare you insult the memory of a dead family. Who knows what was going through his mind that kept him from doing something like putting the car in neutral. It was a terrible accident which needlessly took human lives. If the manufacturer were truly more safety conscious, things like this would not occur.
How dare you insult the memory of a dead family. Who knows what was going through his mind that kept him from doing something like putting the car in neutral. It was a terrible accident which needlessly took human lives. If the manufacturer were truly more safety conscious, things like this would not occur.
Well Paul, mechanical things do wiered things and break all the time. It's why they are called mechanical and not eternal. What if you bought a new hand gun and a bullet jammed on you. Bullets jam from manufacturers imperfections sometimes. If you try to unjam it the improper way while looking down the barrel and it takes your head off, is it the manufacturers fault you are dumb?
Here in Dumbamerica, it is OK for everything to be some one else's fault. And with that complaciency simple life saving procedures are NEVER taught to young drivers, or professionals. I won't even discuss all the actions that could have been taken in this instience, but I will say. "YOU are the only one in control of your machine. If you do not know how to control the machine, DON'T operate it. Ignorance is not a vertue, and life is frail. You would think this would spur better training for emergency procedures, but Dumbamericans think lawsuits are the lottery. Even the judge could make part of this settlement education, but he probabally gets donations from the trial lawyers, and the machine grinds on. So sad to see this at the holidays. But then again, dumb never sleeps.
Have you read about that particular model before making this very uneducated and blatantly ignorant comment? That particular model has a safety feature to KEEP THE CAR FROM TURNING OFF. The driver was not aware of that feature and, in fact, tried multiple times to turn the car off or put it into neutral. He was unable to put the car in neutral because of the safety feature as well. Of course he was a skilled driver, more skilled than you are I since he was highly trained. Why do you think the jury awarded $10m? Maybe you are smarter than a group of your peers (the jury) but I seriously doubt it.
Fact: This case never went to a jury because it was settled, so the jury did not award $10M.
Just because someone is a cop does not make him a safe or skilled driver, just as driver training does not make everyone fit to be driving on public roads.
This was a hack job from teh very beginning. All the complaints agaisnt Toyota came flowing in less than 1 month after the NTSB changed to accepting complainst via web site and not letting the manufactureres investigate issues before they spread the panic and lawyer inspiring stories all over the news. Slam toyota....make more room for the poor quality GM products...
Should have been more.
Well, this was bound to happen after Obama and his welfare stormtroopers expropriated the auto companies and the banks. Ever notice that they didn't take-over any of Hugo Chavez's Citgo stations? Well, I don't believe in conspiracies, but you be the judge.
I'm glad to see a reasonable amount and that the family saw it for what it was a simple accident. This could have been solved by not having two mats in the drivers side as the dealership did. I hope that the rest of the vultures out there will leave this family alone now that the amount has been made public.
Jim C-1929288, way to make this about Obama. LOL
Jim C............isn't Glen Beck on again? You're missing your talking points again when you don't tune in.
I own my third Lexus, love the car. Hey, the company was liable and paid. Haven't all the car companies had problems. This country allows you to buy any car you want, Japanese, American German, whatever. Do your homework and pick the car.
If you are overly concerned about safety, stay home under the blankets. Everything is a risk, enjoy the ride or take a bus.
Lar,
Your so right. At least they did not wait 20 years before fessing up like GM and those side mounted gas tanks. Oh yeah we all forgot about all those poor souls who lost their lives in trucks catching on fire. Did you see GM step up and pay out to all those who lost loved ones. NO! THEY DID NOT, they sent all the registered owners of those trucks a $1000 certificate Rebate towards the purchase of a new GM vehicle. Oh Boy Whoopie I just got a $1000 dollars to use if I buy a truck from GM after they fried Grand Pa. At least Toyota stepped up. I worked for them and they will pay when its their fault. They are good about taking care of business. Especially when it comes to their reputation as a Car Manufacturer.
Toyota Sucks and so do their cars !
Stan
I happen to have taken my Lexus in for scheduled maintenance today. The give me loaner, a brand new Lexus, and charge me nothing. The do excellent work, clean the car no charge. I will say that a $20 oil change costs $35 but the overall value is there. And today's maintenance was not cheap. I have had the car 6 years with no problems. Rides really smooth. You can say what you want about Toyota. My experience has been excellent.
What is your experience or are you just ranting? And what makes the company suck, did you work there?
sorry you're so upset about your jap toyota company...my GM car is the budget Calvalier 1999 that I bought new and still running fine today with over 150,000 miles and thats a 2.2 4 cyl...which I still get over 30 mpg....and when I buy a new one it will be another GM car and one made in the us as I will research which ones are....I believe a car is only as good as you take care of it..and I take good care of mine...
Stan
I don't know why you think I am upset with the Jap company. I still don't know why you are upset with the Jap company. And I am glad that your experience with GM has been good. I am a strong Patriot of this country. I just happen to believe that if I can afford to buy and maintain a good car, the Jap Lexus is a good buy. That is Capitalism. I buy American whenever it is practical. I think we are both proud Americans, and America is about choice.
Merry Christmas,
A company that commits fraud is not to be trusted. $10,000,000.00 is pocket change to them. It's like you handing a dollar to a homeless guy; shallow and ineffective.
Toyota has claimed that their cars do not unintentionally accelerate unless the gas pedal is trapped under the floor mat or there is driver error. In this case it seems that since this incident took place over such a prolonged period of time the pedal is unlikely to have been the cause nor does driver error seem to fit. Is this an admittance by Toyota that there may be a third scenario causing these issues?
They did a recall on many pedals that failed to return this car had an two floor matson top of each other it is the dealers fault!!!
Todd, read the article: "Investigators determined that a wrong-size floor mat trapped the accelerator and caused the crash". There was nothing wrong with the Lexus. There is no ghost in the machine. The Lexus dealer put a non-factory floormat in the vehicle which slid up and trapped the accelerator. And for what it's worth, this has happened many times in the past with many different makes and models of vehicles. The Toyota story was blown out of proportion by an opportunistic NHTSA and media.
marc, I am so tired of hearing this. You can mat the accelerator in any modern automobile and the braking system will over power the drive-train...unless there is something wrong.
Todd, your right. The brake system will override the power train in any modern vehicle. So why did'nt the driver push the brake? He could have stopped the vehicle and saved his and his family's lives.
Actually I do not understand why he did not place the vehicle in neutral and apply the brake or turn off the ignition before the vehicle reached an unmanageable speed.
brakes were reported to be on fire they had been depressed for so long and hard trying to overcome the engine. No key to turn off the vehicle as it had a button to start it and you need to press the button for 3 seconds for it to shut off. Unfortunately no one told the driver this little fact, and when a car's engine races out of control your adrenaline will take over and not give you the presence of mind to start looking into the owner's manual.
Agree with Auto, I sold Toyota's for a long time. If you did not place the mats in correctly and most did not know this, if you failed to install the catch clip which will mount to the floors carpet to keep the floor mat stretched taught towards the drivers seat. They may find out that many where improperly installed during Pre- Delivery Inspection that is performed at Dealer level. I know that alot of dealers would leave it up to the Salesperson to put the mats in and install the catch clip. Not a great scenario for QC.
I think this entire country needs a logical enema. Has anybody ever heard of personal responsibility? How can you even consider that driver error was not to blame? Have you ever heard of neutral? What happens to the engine when you turn the key off? I wonder if the guy didn't go psychotic and just decide to kill off the whole fam damily. I can't believe a highway patrolman didn't have better sense than that.
But you people think it was a fair award? Yesireee! America the sue happy. Maybe I should crush my thumb with a hammer and sue Stanley for making such a dangerous tool without guards. Or I could cut my leg off with a chain saw and sue Stihl for making the chain sharp. Oh, I know - I'll drink 10 gallons of water, keel over, then sue the city for not regulating it (or at least my kids can sue if I die)! The dumb a$$es on an American jury will give me millions. Hell, I have a thousand percent better chance of getting rich from frivolous lawsuits than winning the lottery!
Yep! Three generations of public schooling has just about dumbed us down to the mentally retarded range.
http://www.caranddriver.com/features/09q4/how_to_deal_with_unintended_acceleration-tech_dept
marc, I am so tired of hearing this. You can mat the accelerator in any modern automobile and the braking system will over power the drive-train...unless there is something wrong.
Todd,
With the throttle full open the brake system pressure falls off. This makes the brakes seem to not work, and you are required to push them to the floor to get any response. They will stop the car in this condition, but it is not easy. The fact that the brakes were on fire tells me he was most likely not using enough pressure, allowing the brakes to over heat from friction without actually generating enough force to noticeably slow the car.
And before you say it, I don't work for the dealership, I don't work for Lexus, and I drive a Saab. It's a stick shift.
I have however performed this little test in test drives of most cars I've ever considered buying. Call me crazy, but brake perfomance and brake fade are the kind of thing I pay attention to.
Why didn't the driver just put it in neutral? The gas may have stuck, and the brakes failed, but a car can always be placed in neutral. It's just one click forward from Drive, for Pete's sake!
Unless you have never been at a 100 MPH before and in traffic the person driving probably didn't think about it (The cop was not the one driving).
Very easy to "assume" what you could or couldn't do in a situation when you are not in it.
Vehicles don't go from 60-100 mph in the blink of an eye. BTW- I don't have to assume what I WOULD have done - I already know. When they say "don't panic," they really mean it. I am sorry for this family's loss, but unfortunately, not everyone knows how to act at the time of a crisis. Next time you pass an injury accident, see how many people stop to help vs how many just slow down to get a good look-sie. Some people in life are simply spectators, other's: participants.
I agree, turn the key off, push the "start" button, put it in neutral, something other than riding the thing to death! There are lots of things that could have been done, speculation at best at this point. People died needlessly and all they would have had to do is keep their cool and turn the damn thing off. I had a situation where the throttle stuck at 100% and the speed started to increase from 55mph up to 70mph before I turned the key off, coasted to the side of the freeway and got it fixed...No one died, no fire, no drama at all......
But the CHP training didn't have your procedure in their manual.
I agree. This took time. If you are unable to react in collected fashion you may not belong behind the wheel. For all of our sake.
Interesting that many forget what happens in a panic situation. Those who have had near misses know what happens. Your seat sucks up into your rectum just before you wreck em.
Actually, I have had several near misses (usually the other guys fault) and never did freak out. I hit a mountain on black ice once. Stayed cool calm and collected before, during, and after. Just couldn't quite get it in control. Some people don't have the gene I guess.
If the driver had enough time to be talking for an extended period with the 911 operator, he certainly had enough time to figure out whether a stuck floor mat was causing the accelerator to jam, and more than enough time to shift into neutral.
"Vehicles don't go from 60-100 mph in the blink of an eye. BTW."
Guess you've never driven a Lexus. Try six seconds. They're quick!
Tim count it out 6 seconds, that is a prettly long time, plus there was a cop in the car where was his training then? Sure people panic but you had a trained office that is trained to pursue people at fast speeds. Yeha 6 seconds is fast but not that fast.
I sure hope they do something smart with that money. If there are any surviving children (or young cousins, nieces, nephews, grandchildren, etc.), the money should be put into a 529 plan for them.
Good idea!!! Most broke people that get money like this just turn up broke because they don't save their money and do what you just said. Pay off all debt, save, save, save!!
So, what percentage of the settlement does the lawyer take as his fee? 30%? 50% Nice work, if you can get it.
I wish Toyota would own up that there is a real problem with their throttle system and quit saying the wrong size floor mat causes the problem. Toyota and or the supplier of the throttle system needs to do something other than blame a floor mat. Sure a floor mat can impede the throttle pedal if it gets in the way, but a floor is not going to give maximum acceleration to speeds of over 120 mph. Something in the throttle system malfunctioned, plain and simple!!!
Toyota set up!!
None of the government engineers can find a fault with the throttle system. If you know what it is then it's your responsibility to inform the engineers.
Where's the proof???
The proof is in the money trail, Toyota paid $50 million to the government in fines for not telling them material disclosures about their faulty product. If they didn't have a problem why did they hid reports and internal memos from engineering departments? Why did they settle for 10 million to one family if there isn't a problem with their product?
The basic issue is the control scheme used by toyota on the throttle system.
GM system (also a drive by wire system ) uses zero volts as zero acceleration on the reponse profile. this makes it so if nothing else unplug it works to stop the control loop.
That being said the reported toyota system uses a +5 Volt signal as zero setpoint.
What does this mean you ask ? It means the profile is now inverted and unplugging the device doesn't necessarily work the input will now "float" to some DC voltage determined by the EM Field present.
The entire problem could be resolved by switching to the USA - GM design creteria but the Japanse are too proud to accept our system and they devised thier own.
Gm does not us 0 V as the bottom voltage they use it uses .5 Volts and a 4.5 V as a high any thing out of that sets a fault. Did you know that the pedal Toyota uses has two sensors in it?
Volkswagen is number two in acceleration complaints. There system uses two different base voltage reference signal .5 and 1.2 volts they also have one of the best brake overrides out there.
My 12 year old son makes fun of Toyota everytime they have a commerical on TV to sell cars. They always mention that Toyota is moving forward. My kid says yeah duh because they can't stop! I will never trust a Toyota after this incident. When my kid is old enough to drive it will be a GM auto with OnStar capability. It may end up saving my kids life someday. GM and Ford both have very competitve smaller size vehicles and are definitely worth a look for those needing a car and fuel economy.
JoAnn, GM is only in the business because they screwed their creditors and your kids and grandkids were forced by Obama to bail them out. There was no money in the treasury to pay for this and the other bailouts so it was added to the national debt which now stands at 14 trillion. That is nearly 47 thousand for every man woman and child in the US and about many times that for every taxpayer. Do yourself and your kids a favor and buy the Ford.
Vernon,
Please read George W Bush's book that is in bookstores now, go to near the end and read how he GW Bush, said he knew he had no choice but to save GM, so it was he he took the TARP money and loaned it to them.
The did not all go to washington during 2008 to talk to a president who was not yet elected.
But Edward, why would Vernon do that? It wouldn't fit his prejudices!
here is the 12 largest single recalls
1. Ford 1996 7.9 million
2. GM 1971 6.7 million
3. Gm 1981 5.8 million
4. Toyota 2010 5.3 million
5. Ford 2005 4.5 million
6. Ford 2009 4.5 million
7. Ford 1972 4.0 million
8. GM 1973 3.7 million
9. Volkswagen 1972 3.7 million
10. Honda 1972 3.7 million
11. Ford 1987 3.6 million
12. GM 2004 3.6 million
SO I'M sorry Toyota did make the top 12 list for largest recalls How many times?
this is the total number of recalls (not number of cars)
223
Acura Recalls
Year Model Summary
8
Alfa Romeo Recalls
Year Model Summary
41
Aston Martin Recalls
Year Model Summary
263
Audi Recalls
Year Model Summary
208
Bentley Recalls
Year Model Summary
792
BMW Recalls
Year Model Summary
298
Buick Recalls
Year Model Summary
254
Cadillac Recalls
Year Model Summary
1,597
Chevrolet Recalls
Year Model Summary
515
Chrysler Recalls
Year Model Summary
60
Daewoo Recalls
Year Model Summary
9
Daihatsu Recalls
Year Model Summary
2
Demo Recalls
Year Model Summary
1,263
Dodge Recalls
Year Model Summary
71
Eagle Recalls
Year Model Summary
118
Ferrari Recalls
Year Model Summary
2,446
Ford Recalls
Year Model Summary
40
Geo Recalls
Year Model Summary
877
GMC Recalls
Year Model Summary
709
Honda Recalls
Year Model Summary
35
Hummer Recalls
Year Model Summary
245
Hyundai Recalls
Year Model Summary
148
Infiniti Recalls
Year Model Summary
135
Isuzu Recalls
Year Model Summary
148
Jaguar Recalls
Year Model Summary
479
Jeep Recalls
Year Model Summary
102
Kia Recalls
Year Model Summary
13
Lamborghini Recalls
Year Model Summary
139
Land Rover Recalls
Year Model Summary
168
Lexus Recalls
Year Model Summary
174
Lincoln Recalls
Year Model Summary
317
Mazda Recalls
Year Model Summary
359
Mercedes-Benz Recalls
Year Model Summary
335
Mercury Recalls
Year Model Summary
23
MINI Recalls
Year Model Summary
430
Mitsubishi Recalls
Year Model Summary
623
Nissan Recalls
Year Model Summary
286
Oldsmobile Recalls
Year Model Summary
10
Peugeot Recalls
Year Model Summary
296
Plymouth Recalls
Year Model Summary
424
Pontiac Recalls
Year Model Summary
136
Porsche Recalls
Year Model Summary
-
Rolls Royce Recalls
Year Model Summary
92
Saab Recalls
Year Model Summary
200
Saturn Recalls
Year Model Summary
-
Smart Recalls
Year Model Summary
191
Subaru Recalls
Year Model Summary
117
Suzuki Recalls
Year Model Summary
822
Toyota Recalls
Year Model Summary
391
Volkswagen Recalls
Year Model Summary
395
Volvo Recalls
Carles and Sean, Please let me know when they are going to pay back the money they stole from me and the other secured bond holders.
Vernon Hickman,
You are right, the TARP people always FORGET this, and the stock holders that were hosed.
Auto 101,
To give a balanced FACTUAL satistical report.
You also need to report the TOTAL numbers of people KILLED & Injured by the defects of these vehicles.....
I think the numbers will reflect that FORD is #1 and TOYOTA is #2.
BTY - to be creditable you need to list your REFERENCES for the info presented.
go the the Government web site for recalls and add them up for yourself.
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/recalls/recallsearch.cfm
Jo Ann, congradulation's to you and your son. I hope he really does buy a made in USA auto when he become's old enough to drive. Everybody should buy USA made products over import's, IF IT'S POSSIBLE, to keep people working in the USA!
The jap anese transplants are not American they are a seed from japan and 85% of the sales money go's back to their home land, japan. Buy from a American owned company and stop supporting the jap anese economy.
WHAT PROFITS???GM EARNED NO PROFITS WITH THE UAW WHICH IS WHY THEY WENT BANKRUPT!
Thats why I buy from Walmart because its an American company EARNING profits!
Just like GM cars builds in Mexico, Who cares that its made in China when the profits go to the U.S. right?
If GM builds all their cars in Mexico and China while Toyota builds cars in America, you'll still buy GM right ?
I bet you don't care that Chrysler profits will go to Italy as long as UAW members are getting their paychecks... truth is that you support paying UAW workers even if they work for foreign owners but not non-union American workers.
UAW screws over American GM investors too, so you wonder why many dont give a shyt about GM if the UAW works there?
You want to save American auto companies, let them hire Americans who don't want to join the UAW.
You UAW guys are all traitors to demand other Americans lose their jobs and to blackmail American companies into bankruptcies.
Go live in mexico if you want to buy a mexican built gm car.... or just replace uaw workers with illegal mexicans in the u.s.
I'm suggesting to purchase anything that is made in the USA, to keep USA worker's in a JOB!!!!!! Do I need to be any clearer!!!!!!
Many toyotas are made in the u.s. by Americans.
Those toyotas are better for u.s. workers than gm cars built in mexico.
Americans who work for Sony and Toyota in the usa are paying for GM's bailout with their tax dollars.
If GM UAW workers are paid with tax money from other americans and money borrowed from China, Gm cars are worthless in value for our economy.
Travis, F#CK YOU and the japs! Ignorant fool!
I've driven Toyotas since 1984 without any problems like this. I have driven cars where the floor mat made the gas pedal stick (they were all american made), and I reacted in a correct way. I've even had the rear axle come out of a Ford while driving down the road which also caused the brake pedal to go to the floor, and I handled that one without incident. Personally I think this was a driver error but I'll never know the actual facts.
People keep pushing American made cars which in my opinion still can't touch a Toyota or Honda in reliability. And they're being made in the USA so but them and keep those people working.
It's just like the woman with the McDonalds coffee. Yes it's hot, but mom taught me that when it's hot to be careful. Also taught me not to put anything in a wall outlet too but I guess that'll be the next big law suit from someone.
Oh and it's amazing how people forget all the accidents that domestic cars have caused over the years with exploding gas tanks etc.
It's all BS by people looking for money.
Toyota's suck and so do their crappy cars....
Here are a few of the FACTS:
1. The Dealer installed the incorrect floor mats. So I'm assuming they knew about the mat clips.
2. The same vehicle have PRIOR COMPLAINTS of a sticking throttle.
3. That vehicle did not have the ECM that cancelled the throttle inputs when the brakes were activated. The NEW vehicles do and TOYOTA has reprogrammed many of their prior vehicles ECM to incorporate this.
4. The ECM feature of throttle deactivation when the brakes have been activated was a ACCEPTED INDUSTRY SAFETY FEATURE for over a DECADE.
5. This NEW LOANER had the brake pads burned down to METAL-on-METAL, after the crash. Eye witness reports that the brake lights were ON - prior to the crash.
Do not let the TRUE facts cloud your adoration for TOYOTA.
As long as you agree that facts also prove that GM and the UAW suck.
Hey Mike, I have been driving AMERICAN CARS since the mid 70'S and never had any MAJOR problems with any of them unlike a few foolish friends who paid lots in repairs. SO WHAT IS YOUR POINT.
That was a good decision, but they need to stand by their products better to keep loyal repeat customers. Been a Ford man all my life till they blew it. Bought my wife a new 08 Escape - great car, then my 05 Sport Trac (bought new) started peeling paint at 30,000 miles. Called them, went to dealer. They did nothing! Damn shame. Sooner or later the chickens come home to roost!
More people die in natural disasters everyday is this really news worthy or just a way for low lifes to slam on TOYOTA? REALLY? FORD AND CHEVY killed just as many peple over the years, makes no difference what you drive, stupid people crash and die everyday... I'd Gave them $10.00 settlement for being stupid..
You like your TOYOTA???
Do this after you ensure your; car, health, and life insurance polices a UP-Dated.
On a deserted multi-lane highway, accelerate to posted speed. Then floor the gas petal and hold it there.
Using your other foot apply the brakes:
1. On a STANDARD ECM (electronic throttle) the throttle input will be deactivated and return engine to the DASH setting. (Fast idle) The brakes will then slow and stop the vehicle. Easily over-riding the slow running engine.
2. On the early TOYOTA the ECM would not deactivate the throttle input. And the Engine would keep running and accelerating until WOT (max allowed throttle). At high throttle settings the engine develops minimum vacuum.
After you apply the vacuum power assisted brakes several times. The vacuum reservoir for the brakes is depleted. Resulting in minimum braking ability. Continued application of the brakes will do NOTHING, even if you apply the parking brake.
BTY - You can return the brakes to NORMAL Function if you allow the throttle to return to a slower engine speed. If your throttle/ECM does not malfunction....
I'm a certified Master Auto Tech - ASE and have been working in the field for decades.
AC Robertson,
Many Lexus vehicles don't have a vacuum booster they use the accumulator on the ABS to provide the assist.
You need to go back and take your recert test again.. on ABS systems.
The Lexus ES350 uses vacuum assisted power brakes.
The accumulator/high pressure pump is NOT used , unless the wheel sensors detect the need to pulsate the wheels brake pressure. To prevent wheel lock-up and loss of control.
ABS will not affect how the brake pressure feels when driving normally and is only functional during emergency situations. On the new vehicles every wheel has its own speed sensor. When one or more wheels speed CHANGES these sensors enable the ABS to select which wheel needs to be pumped, to prevent brake induced lock-up.
The ABS accumulator is NOT used for power assist during NORMAL braking. Only for pulsating the pressure when the wheels try to lock-up.
However if the vehicle had power brake assist it would give that pressure that was needed. their for the accumulator gives more pressure to the brake system to help in panic braking and does not pulsate the brakes.
and yes you are right this car dose have a vacuum booster.
By the way I am sorry I keep thinking about the LS line and the way its brakes work. the ES is the more common and many do have the power brake assist.
I WILL NEVER BUY A TOYOTA and I wish everyone in this USA would boycott toyota till there are no more of there cars here. just wait til your loved one is killed because of a toyota then see how you feel.
I wish everyone in *some other USA* would do that. In *this* USA, I'm glad they're not going to.
Have we already forgotten the Ford Explorer which exploded on rear impact?
Every car company is going to have something like this. If you only buy from companies with perfect safety records you'll soon be pedaling to work.
Eric.......you must have already "forgotten" it was the Pinto that exploded on impact. That was almost 40 years ago and you're still holding on to that?
If that is the case let's go back to December 7 1941 and blame the japs for all the battleship sinking and deaths that day. No different that the Muslim extremists that crashed the twin towers.............gotta love the Japs and their Toyotas
how about all the cops that got burned literally it happened when they were rear ended!
It is tragic what happened to that officer and his family. However, it is HIS FAULT! Any CHP who is too stupid to know how to put a car into Neutral is beyond help! I own a Toyota and and Lexus. Never had finer cars, including Chevy, Pontiac, Mercedes and VW. I bought the Lexus and Toyota *after* this incident. Completely satisfied!
Have you read about that particular model before making this very uneducated and blatantly ignorant comment? That particular model has a safety feature to KEEP THE CAR FROM TURNING OFF. The driver was not aware of that feature and, in fact, tried multiple times to turn the car off or put it into neutral. He was unable to put the car in neutral because of the safety feature as well. Of course he was a skilled driver, more skilled than you are I since he was highly trained. Why do you think the jury awarded $10m? Maybe you are smarter than a group of your peers (the jury) but I seriously doubt it.
@A-Person -- You are an incredibly uncompassionate person. Have you ever been in that situation? You should think about what you're saying before you make such a moronic statement.
a & p your weird, your rice burners and you are beyond help.
Strange that a state trooper didn't know how to slow/stop a car. I'd have tried all of these: down shift, shift into neutral, brake, turn off engine. It's not like the car can accelerate that fast that you wouldn't have time to react.
Sounds like it was stuck all the way to the floorboard. Maybe it all happened in a matter of seconds?
The events leading up to the accident took several minutes and many miles of freeway to play out.
JoAnn: tell your kid that brakes are there for a reason, to stop the car. Also, tell him that Ford Mustangs are great for burn outs, and power slides (drifting). He'll love ya for it!!
Get over the exploding gas tank and move on to something newer like the explorer rollovers. More to the point , the article is not about who's at fault. It's about a judge deciding to make public the settlement amount and the people not personally involved thinking it's their right to know how much the settlement was for.
We all want to buy american, yet circumstance$ make us look elsewhere. Reason: quality and more bang for the buck. Toyota made some mistakes, but their track record is better than our domestic carmakers. The UAW are their own worst enemy! They protect mediocracy. Lived 6 years in Japan. Their number one carmaker is Toyota. Their has got to be a reason for that. It's longevity! Cars are a major investment anymore. Nissan is not even close.
I work for a Honda dealer and can assure you at least Ford has gone by when it comes to quality. The Japs are living on reputations of yesteryears. If what I see on a daily basis continues american car companies will be at least 1-2 in the world again within 8-10 years.
then go back to Japan if you like them so much...
Ridiculous. 10M for people who couldnt find the brake pedal or the ignition switch. Its a sad day when people are not held responsible for the way they drive their cars. Good thing for them I wasnt on that jury.
yeah afterall he wanted to kill his family, must have been his fault that the car had a design defect. Stupid guy deserved it.......right?
Anthony......put away the bong dude
You are just plain mean. Have you heard anything about this case?
To mark: Mark, lets say you buy a hand gun and it jams. Instead of unjamming it the proper way, the safe way that will not get you killed, you look down the barrel and put a bullet in your brain. Now whos fault is it that you did the dumb thing? The gun manufacturer?
RambleNut,
Did your gun happen to jam while traveling at 120mph+??
I think an example such as yours is complete nonsense as a comparison.
As a much better example....... lets say that the gun manufacture had prior knowledge of their product not only jamming but going off by itself and they don't reveal this to the buying public. Now what do you have to say?
I have been driving for about 50 years. I have had the experience a several times where the accelerator pedal got stuck under a floor mat. It took me all of maybe a second and a half to reach down and pull the floor mat back to un-stick the gas pedal.
I find it hard to believe that a hiway patrol officer who is supposed to be experienced and knowledgeable in driving would not do the same thing I did instinctively. In fact, it boggles my mind.
I do not think the officer was driving but I would think that it would be instinctive to try to stop using the brake system or just putting it in neutral or even turning off the ignition, I have had experiences with older cars where the motor mounts have broken and this has jammed the accelerator pedal and I simply reached down and pulled it up and if that did not work I popped the car in neutral.
"I find it hard to believe that a highway patrol officer who is supposed to be experienced and knowledgeable in driving would not do the same thing I did instinctively. In fact, it boggles my mind."
Maybe the fact it boggles the mind indicates there was more to the evidence than we know about...that and $10 mil. If there was an indication that the driver was incompetent, there wouldn't have been much of an award.
The TOYOTA has a 'Electronic Throttle and Shifter control'. The CHP Office was driving a vehicle that had a HISTORY of throttle control/ECM problems.
If the ECM malfunctioned, he could have LOST Control of BOTH the throttle and transmission. Maybe even effecting the ability to TURN-OFF the IGNITION. Only TOYOTA really knows...
To infer that he PANICKED is BS. He had the foresight to call 911 and inform the Dispatcher of what was happening, during the incident. The recording of this call was published by the Media.
The NEW "Electronic Control' vehicles are NOT the same vehicle it was even 6+years ago. The same as comparing a Cessna to a 777, NO COMPARISON.
AC Robertson,
They Transmission still has a mechanical linkage. only the shift pattern and gear selection is controlled by the TCM this is the way almost all 2000 vehicles and up ASE refuse to recognize the TCM being the master mind of the Transmission they still think it is the Valve body.
Like you stated, "the shift pattern and gear selection is controlled by the TCM."
The direct mechanical linkage is there to electronically input the TCM and mechanically engage the Transmission Lock for parking.
The linkage does mechanically put the Transmission in neutral. But this is not on all vehicles.
keep buying the jap rides people!
Don't forget the gook Korean rides are getting better too.
I can't believe you two. Jap rides and gook Korean rides. You two disgust me to no end. You are what is wrong with this Nation. Your stupid racist comments. Well if the Domestics had done a better job of building cars and not waited till they got our tax dollars to stay in business. I have been in the Automotive Industry for 27 years. I will say this. The domestics are better now then they where by far in the 80's. Yet they still have a long ways to go. If I was going to purchase a Domestic vehicle I would not buy Government Motors or Fix it Again Tony owned Chrysler. The Japanese and Koreans have made the Domestics get off their duffs and build a better car. The only domestic car worth owning is Ford! They did not take money and they are going after the likes of Toyota. FYI if you two rednecks are going to tell me that's why jobs are overseas, your more ignorant then I thought.Toyota and the other foreign manufacturers now operate more factories here in the USA then the Domestics, ask Mexico , Canada, and China how our jobs are doing,. Ford is the only one who has gone on record to begin opening their domestic idled plants again. Go sit down drink your Budweiser and watch some bowl games and stay away from the computer.
has nothing to do with whats made here or not, Suk Toyotas is a Japanese company, and the only reason they open plants here was so they can say Hey! we makey cars in usa now!...and with all the tax credits they got , you got a lot of gall to say anything about the domestic bailouts..the japanese and Korea's got plenty of Tax(bailout)cut money..for their plants and the people they hired..watch when all them cuts run out and they pull a China-mart and move those jobs to china...
toy yoyo is a overrated trash can, dump them in tokyo bay.
I can't believe a state trooper couldn't push the shift lever into neutral. He found time to call on a cell phone to tell someone he couldn't stop, he had plenty of time to shift out of drive even if he couldn't shut the car off. Very sad ending for a trained driver.
Is there a possibility that the transmission was somehow frozen in drive? I'm sure whoever he spoke to on the phone would suggest to put it in neutral. Why didn't the brakes stop or at least slow down the car so he could run it into something? Many times a "disaster" is not caused by one issue, but an unfortunate chain of issues.
he did run it into something.... and died.
How dare you insult the memory of a dead family. Who knows what was going through his mind that kept him from doing something like putting the car in neutral. It was a terrible accident which needlessly took human lives. If the manufacturer were truly more safety conscious, things like this would not occur.
How dare you insult the memory of a dead family. Who knows what was going through his mind that kept him from doing something like putting the car in neutral. It was a terrible accident which needlessly took human lives. If the manufacturer were truly more safety conscious, things like this would not occur.
Well Paul, mechanical things do wiered things and break all the time. It's why they are called mechanical and not eternal. What if you bought a new hand gun and a bullet jammed on you. Bullets jam from manufacturers imperfections sometimes. If you try to unjam it the improper way while looking down the barrel and it takes your head off, is it the manufacturers fault you are dumb?
Here in Dumbamerica, it is OK for everything to be some one else's fault. And with that complaciency simple life saving procedures are NEVER taught to young drivers, or professionals. I won't even discuss all the actions that could have been taken in this instience, but I will say. "YOU are the only one in control of your machine. If you do not know how to control the machine, DON'T operate it. Ignorance is not a vertue, and life is frail. You would think this would spur better training for emergency procedures, but Dumbamericans think lawsuits are the lottery. Even the judge could make part of this settlement education, but he probabally gets donations from the trial lawyers, and the machine grinds on. So sad to see this at the holidays. But then again, dumb never sleeps.
Have you read about that particular model before making this very uneducated and blatantly ignorant comment? That particular model has a safety feature to KEEP THE CAR FROM TURNING OFF. The driver was not aware of that feature and, in fact, tried multiple times to turn the car off or put it into neutral. He was unable to put the car in neutral because of the safety feature as well. Of course he was a skilled driver, more skilled than you are I since he was highly trained. Why do you think the jury awarded $10m? Maybe you are smarter than a group of your peers (the jury) but I seriously doubt it.
"Have you read about that particular model before making this very uneducated and blatantly ignorant comment?"
Not sure who you are directing your anger at, but I agree about the "uneducated" and "ignorant" part.
Fact: The engine on the Lexus ES350 CAN be turned off if you press and hold the start button for 3 seconds.
Fact: The transmission on the Lexus ES350 CAN be shifted into neutral at any time.
http://www.caranddriver.com/features/09q4/how_to_deal_with_unintended_acceleration-tech_dept
Fact: This case never went to a jury because it was settled, so the jury did not award $10M.
Just because someone is a cop does not make him a safe or skilled driver, just as driver training does not make everyone fit to be driving on public roads.
This was a hack job from teh very beginning. All the complaints agaisnt Toyota came flowing in less than 1 month after the NTSB changed to accepting complainst via web site and not letting the manufactureres investigate issues before they spread the panic and lawyer inspiring stories all over the news. Slam toyota....make more room for the poor quality GM products...