Airlines are profiteers? Duh! It's a business. And why would you blame the airline for an unruly plane. It's people who are out of control. Americans have become spoiled, fat and self-indulgent narcissists. That's not the airlines fault. Civility has left the building.

I agree w/Pam338163, if someone wants to get VIP service they should rent their own private jet.

Pam and NorCal have obviously not flown lately or have done so only in first class. Air travel is an absolute mess. The airlines have halved their fleets and shoehorned more seats to make the planes not only more crowded but more cramped. I'm not talking about big planes either, they've scrapped all of the 747 jumbo jets for tiny, narrow planes that never had any room on them even before they started all this bunk. I thought these conditions were horrible on four hour trips to Vegas. Then I fly to Europe this summer in the "new" conditions. Try 13 hours in the middle seat with the seat back in front of you pressed against your knees. If an airline can't provide minimal comfort, they should go out of business.

Midwest used to have extra leg room, no more, doesn't make sense to pay more to fly with them anymore. Charging for the bags is a huge inconvenience because now you have to get it through security and schlepp it all over the airport. They should just add the price into the ticket. Airfare plus car rental costs have now gone up so much it is cost-efficient to take the cartrain down to FL from DC nowadays.

I disagree w/Pam338163, being a business does NOT justify gouging customers or treating them disrespectfully.

I don't know where that opinion of business strategy/practices was gained, but it appears to lack the knowledge required for understanding the long-term impact of irresponsible, self-serving business practices on both people AND the market.

ANY decent economist can tell you that raising prices and lowering service quality only succeeds in driving AWAY customers. Considering the state of the airline industry, this is not a wise strategy to attract customers or increase revenue over the long-term. Obviously, the consolidation of the airline industry has emboldened them to raise prices and lower customer service. Watch and learn people, this is why market consolidation is a BAD idea.

I am in complete agreement with Pam and Nor Cal. I am not an inexperienced flyer. I have flown coach significantly (for work) in the last 3 years. I always try to sit in one of the last three seats - and bring two bags that I check (the airline should enforce the checking policy). People have become cry-babies and rude -- its amazing what people believe they are owed (for nothing/next-to-nothing no less). Hello, it costs money to run a business... where do you get it? From the customer. There are options - plane, train, boat, car, bus. Figure out what works with your budget.

Profiteering??  The industry has lost money for decades.  They should charge for taking luggage on the plane, but not in the luggage compartment.  Better yet, cut the nitpicking and raise ticket fees to some sustainable level.

try living in an area where your ONLY transportation to other locations is by air (on an island) and see what travel is like. Here on St. Croix (USVI) we have limited service from AA/AE, Delta and USAir, with Cape Air and Seaborne providing connections to San Juan for other airlines. Just to go to Miami can now cost us $600-800 unless we can catch a "netsaver" with American. For me to bring my mother down from OH, it is a 12-14 hour trip with half of that sitting in Chicago and San Juan awaiting connections. A year ago, that ticket, booked three months in advance, cost me over $800. NO meals, baggage charges for both of her bags, etc. For me to travel to Panama, I would have to go from here to San Juan to Miami to Panama City or spend the night in Miami with the direct flight from here to Miami with AA at a cost of over $1000. With COPA, I get a full hot meal included on the 3 hour flight from San Juan to Panama City and the cost with the connection from here to San Juan at around $700. Just to go from here to San Juan is $180-$240 depending on the flight and airline, and it is only a half hour flight and 100 miles. We are really ripped off on this island. STT, because they have more traffic, does have some better fairs, but it costs over $100 just to fly from here to there and that is only 40 miles and 18 minute flight.

I have a question for Pam and Nor Cal. Are you saying that airlines should be able to do whatever they want, and no one should complain? The airline can overbook, it can be rude, it can cram people in small seats, and we can't complain? Give me a break!

What if hotels decided to charge for pillows, or soap, or towels? Would that be OK too?

airlines, cried for de-regulation for years, they got de-regulated over 20 years ago; they almost all are bankrupt,flying older planes,young pilots, and now they are crying about their situation.

Airlines have pissed me off to the point that I try my best NOT to fly when I travel. It just isn't worth it. The seats are narrower, the leg room is cramped, and they nickle and dime you for everything. I'm 6'5" and it is more and more difficult to get my legs behind the seat in front of me and get comfortable.

Be honest and just say what the ticket prices are. let me preface this next comment by saying I am not stupid, I know what happens. Ok, that being said, it drives me nuts when airlines advertise these cheap air fares, like $99 each way. They know there will be taxes and fees for this and that. So do I, as I said. When you advertise the fees, why not just tell us what the real fee is, instead of the $99. sure would be easier to do in the ad, than to have to go through most of the purchase procedure online, to find what the real price is. Just seems silly to me.

My two cents... Bank executives are profiteering in a business that HAS cost us billions. They make millions even though they lost billions.

The airlines are trying to keep their businesses afloat in an environment where everything needed to get a plane from point A to point B has dramatically increased... especially fuel!!! More weight in baggage increases fuel consumption. Ticket prices are not much higher than they were in the 90s when fuels were 60% to 70% cheaper than they are today. I believe that the airlines should scrap these undesirable fees and raise ticket prices as an honest business expense. Allow discounts for passengers who travel "light"... NO BAGGAGE!

People don't seem to complain about the increased cost of a movie ticket. Movies have gone up significantly over the same period... and we have to use our own gas to get there.

Lets face it, we can't expect the airlines to absorb the increase in the cost of living that we are facing... if we want to travel, we should be willing to pay the price for the most convenient option... There's always AMTRAK and GREYHOUND if you don't want to pay what it costs to fly!

AND... If you choose to live in a remote location, then you have to be willing to pay for the access limitations that go with the territory! Personally, I really like Hawaii... but I can't accept the isolation that goes with living in paradise.

It is our society. I've flown Emirates Airline. Let me tell you, it's really obvious that they're there to take care of you. Americans that have never flown a non-American airline such as Singapore Air or Jet Airways India assume that it's par for the course to be treated like cattle and begged for more money on the flights. It's a terrible business model, but it's been successful simply for demand of the necessity of travel. Until people complain, they won't budge.

Look; all they are really doing is "unbundling". In other words, instead of charging the one bag traveler for the 1.8 bag average that they are charging the two bag traveler; they charge each for what they have - and advertise the lower base ticket price.

Computers did this (Compaq used to have a 3 year warranty but had to "unbundle" it to compete) and other services / industries. Airlines are having to compete in a lowest common denominator system because people compare prices - but not bundled services - on the internet so they unbundle for a lower base price then add back all the services people got used to when price was not the number one comparison

I think you guys are all mis-interpreting the original post. I'm not about to get out my dictionary but I think profiteering in this case means making money by illegal means. Now that is maybe untrue and a bit harsh but at a bear minimum airlines are being sneaky and deceptive. As an example I was told to bring my bike would cost me $75. Fair enough as it is an unusual item and i assumed it would be extra and inquired ahead prior to buying my ticket. But then when I got to check-in I was told it would be another $25 for a second bag! As if I would travel with a bike and no bag. The whole 'fuel' charge thing is a joke too. I think airlines should be forced to include all hidden carges in their advertised ticket price. This would hardly cut into their bottom line as they would all be in the same boat and would be fair to the consumer

Allegiant airlines charges$10 for me to book my flight online, instead of at the counter. They call that a 'convenience fee'. Convenient for who????

It's plain, and it is very simple. If it is costing more to have a plane in the air, then raise the ticket prices. Makes all the sense in the world. People would understand, as those who need to fly, will continue to do so. However, nickel and diming passengers once they are on board, or having them pay for extra luggage doesn't hurt those that travel regularly, but it does make people who travel for pleasure think twice about that vacation or trip to visit family. Supposedly, those are the people that are needed to keep airlines viable.

Again, either raise the price of a ticket, or admit that you are nickel and diming passengers simply because you can!

Seem to recall a time when airlines received a bail-out of gov't money. So this is how they repay the public who subsidized their existence in the lean times? Extra fees? How about NO fees and see the publics flock to that airline. This is essentially what Southwest Airlines is doing.

Hope the industry tanks again. Then we can decide whether or not to let it sink or swim or perhaps charge IT a fee to receive bailout money....(?)

So this is how they repay the public who subsidized their existence in the lean times? Extra fees? Of course it is...look at the banks! FEES, FEES, and more FEES!

I really hate flying....but the airlines know they have America right were they want us. What other option do we have. Yes you can drive, but come on, if you are going from coast to coast, you have no option but to fly.....same thing with getting overseas.

We will continue to fly because we have too. Although, I have cut back on my flying a lot over the past year, just stopped going places and doing things. Staying home more and enjoying my back yard.

That IS the purpose, to get from point A to point B. For more than maybe 500 miles there is no better way. I would sure rather cross the Rockies in a cramped plane that a covered wagon, or even a car if I don't have the time.

Flying was a pleasurable experience years ago because people then did not whine as much as people do today and did not demand free things and attention like they do now. I have had good flights 95% of the time. A few late ones here/there. Full planes - but had no problem with space, leg room, etc. Limited kid issues.

BRAVO!!! and reasonably sized seats!!

Reasonable Voice, you are absolutely right. And Opinion Girl, you couldn't be more wrong. I don't know what flights you are on Opinion Girl but I don't hear a lot of people whining on the flights I'm on. What I do hear is excuse after excuse from airlines as to why the flights are late or cancelled, why they have one person checking people in when there are 100 in line, why the luggage got lost, why the plane has to sit on the tarmac because there's no open gate for it to pull into. Also you must be a very small person if you're perfectly happy with the amount of space and leg room you are given on flights today. I'm a tall, very slim person. And I think the space you get is ridiculous - inhumane actually - for an average size person. I'm amazed there isn't more whining about the pathetic product that airlines sell today.

Bring back train travel - to realistic, targeted cities coast to coast and border to border. It will do at least three things; - provide airlines realistic competition; - rebuild an infrastructure in dire need, and - reintroduce the traveling public to travel and SERVICE worth paying for. It will also allow people time to kick-back and smell the roses.

Have you ever travelled overnight on a train? Uggghhhh!!!

The airlines have gone to the smaller regional jets and turbo-props (RJ-7's and Dash 8's) because they use less fuel, AND they can pay those pilots a lot less. RJ pilot in command are getting around 50K-60K a year. As opposed to 747 pilots getting over $300 dollars an hour to fly. And they only work 80 hrs a month.

For all of you frustrated travellers: Do you want to know why they load the plane, close the door and sit on the ramp sometimes for 8hrs??? Because the pilot gets paid from when the door closes to when it is opened. That's why they won't let you stay in the terminal. The crew isn't getting paid when it's at the gate. They'll pay a pilot over 300K a year, but won't give me a pop and bag of peanuts for free.

People didn't "demand" free things in by gone years? No we didn't, because we didn't have to. Meals, soft drinks, and listening to the radio on a flight were free. Did I demand this? No, it was just so! We also had more leg room, and could speak to a flight attendant that didn't act like she was being put upon if you wanted an extra pillow, or if your kid wanted a sandwich other than what was being offered!

It was simply considered good business sense to go that extra mile, because it made for loyal, repeat customers. Now, the public is told that they are whiners or selfish if they expect to get something other than a seat on a multi-hour flight! All this after they get a federal bailout that would have been far better spent in giving each American a free round trip ticket!

Oh, well. I guess things really have changed!

Southwest cheats by not inspecting their planes and using unauthorized parts--they should be shut down, not emulated

Amen, Delta Don...I fly frequently and there was a time I loved to fly Delta. They have made my travel experiences so horrible lately, that I refer to Delta as the airline from HELL.

llife lcws

doetting- do you have proof of your allegation against SW? If yes, then I think you should be reporting it - but if not - it seems irresponsible at the least to put something like that in print.

And in the new age of internet web conferencing, more and more businesses are conducting their meetings that way. You have NO travel costs, no lost time in travel, and you get more accomplished. But when you DO need to physically meet, Part 135 GA charter flights can often be more cost effective and you do fly on your own schedule, can travel to airports other than major/regional airports, etc. However, once again aviation fuel costs have also hurt the charter business. See my post above re: FBO's. The one I worked for also did charter business (still does here in St. Croix USVI and is the main FBO here.)

Right on the money! I come from an airline family = pilots, flight attendants, baggage busters and we all agree with your point of view. Air travel SUCKS and the TSA twits ARE little more than bothersome bullies. Try wearing a tie-dye shirt when going through security and see what happens!

JD excellent post.

you said it JD

JD

You gotta be some kinda mind-reader Bro..I could not have said it any better

I agree with you, Lex. Put the complete cost in the up front ticket price, and stop doing the cell phone company shuffle. I resent them, too.

The price is ok, if the service comes with it! Since they are surly flight attendants, lousy gate agents, horrible ticket agents, and don't even get me started on TSA, why would I want to pay the high price to get hassled? If I drive, no one hassles me; I can get whatever food I want, my kids can watch movies and I can do it all for less money then they want for one ticket plus fees!! Oh, and I can take as many bags as I want!! With no pervert rifling through my underwear or stealing it!

Charge for carry-ons but not luggage compartment. I think it's an imposition on everyone else to have oversized luggage carried on by oversized passengers. Enforce the charge for obesity too.

they don't enforce their own rules about what the size of a carry-on can be.

We are allow to bring food. I always bring a bag with me. Everybody is right about the luggage. Some bring lots of whatever and don't use it. I know I travel with 2 people who bring a lot and don't use 1/2 of them. I book with Delta this summer. I was at the ariport for 8 hrs 6am to 5pm) and still didn't get a flight. Someone took my name off the booking fest. I could go on and on. Whats the use. They call the cops because some people was getting load. Then my other half decide to book with again. At every chager over they was late. They had to put him up in a hotel one night. Do your self a favor and stay away from Delta.

They won't "stop" or even think. There's an old word that leads to inconvenience for awhile but it can be very effective - BOYCOTT. But the traveling public has to organize.

The traveling public picks ONE airline, and chooses a key holiday - like Christmas. Don't fly that airline for the entire Christmas week. Then on Easter pick another one - for a week. Their margins are so thin they'll either shutdown or start to manage THEIR operation and stop cheating the public.

A few instances like that and ALL airlines will get the message. As I've said above, try trains (where they exist). That just might stir up some serious competition for the airlines. That's what they need. Right now they are in each other's pockets. There is NO serious competition. (Monopoly? Price Rigging? Anti-trust?)

Maybe a few more marches on Washington are in order. That seems to be the only way that anyone will shut up and/or listen anymore!

Of course they were always charging for it. But you didn't notice a decline in ticket costs when they added on the fees for the "extras" did you? Now they get to charge you twice!! It's just gotten out of hand.

Then make them friendly again, and I won't complain about the fees! Bring back good customer service and the passengers will come back!

Speak for yourself J Piz. I haven't taken my family to a ball game in years for the exact same reason we avoid flying at all costs. Prices are too high for the service you get.